Pre-Kickstarter Exclusives
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@jetah said in Pre-Kickstarter Exclusives:
As others have said, the server is a server. it isn't a 486 cpu trying to handle 1k connections. testing has a few parts: network code, stability, game mechanics and more. Beta is for network code, client and stability for multiple users. Pre alpha is to make sure there are no detrimental bugs that shut down the server, clog the network or crash the client. pre alpha is more of a proof of concept that things can work.
And where are we right now, when the Kickstarter is about to launch? Oh right, in pre-alpha.
You can expect feedback about game mechanics to matter no earlier than late beta. Where we are now our feedback is irrelevant, because nothing we're going to be seeing will reflect the current vision for the game for us to criticize. Fractured's mechanics are especially interconnected by the standards of MMOs, and thus we can't provide worthwhile feedback until very late in development when all of these mechanics exist in a near-final state for us to see how they influence one another.
Criticizing these mechanics before they are all fully implemented, as will be the case when the Kickstarter is launched, is simply worthless.
i'm just saying that the more people you get in for alpha the worse your feedback will be [...] you won't get as many trolls [at a higher buy-in price]
Yes, you've been repeating that, and you aren't any righter than you were the first time you said it.
Have you actually ever been in an alpha or beta for an MMO before? It consistently turns out that in reality (instead of in hypothesis) that buy-in price and raw playerbase size are both completely and utterly irrelevant to average feedback quality, which is consistently terrible because you are selecting for players, not testers. People who get into Kickstarter want to play your game and get a sweet deal for jumping in early. There are no professional testers who inconceivably pay you to let them test your game, that is the stupidest thing imaginable.
If you want good feedback, you handpick who gives you feedback; i.e. you actually go find a professional tester and you hire them. You don't open the gates, however slightly, and wonder why you're getting a bunch of idiots asking why your alpha game isn't entirely playable.
By the by, because the average feedback quality is unchanged by sample size, you will have better feedback with a larger playerbase if you are able to screen the feedback itself to ensure the dev team receives the best out of the entire sample, because you will just plain get a lot more feedback and the amount of good feedback will increase proportionately.
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crowfall and cu are my current pre-alpha and alpha MMO's. I've seen many people posting negatively about Crowfall and yet it has a low entry to pre-alpha at 50$. I haven't seen that much negativity about CU because it's currently 250 to get into alpha.
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@jetah said in Pre-Kickstarter Exclusives:
crowfall and cu are my current pre-alpha and alpha MMO's. I've seen many people posting negatively about Crowfall and yet it has a low entry to pre-alpha at 50$. I haven't seen that much negativity about CU because it's currently 250 to get into alpha.
You said earlier that the price affected the quality of feedback, but here you're saying it affects the volume of "negative" feedback. Do you mean poor quality feedback or disapproving feedback?
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Anyone whose supporting a game before it even comes close to release deserves some additional stuff. I never liked the "hey look what you get cause you found us first" mentality. Support is support.
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of those 2 i'd say poor quality. meaning that people will just say "x is broken" but wont give details. sure it's feedback but it isn't something the team could work with. Just looking at game subs on Reddit and you'll see plenty of poor quality feedback.
i'm not saying higher priced testing will always give better testers, you just need to be high enough that it rids the testing phases of the most 'unqualified testers'.
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I really believe that design experiences are a wonderful funding option. Offer the ability to design a pet or weapon, charge a nice hefty fee. People love that stuff. Heck create a couple (very few) design experiences for world events or major bosses and you could sell those for an absolute premium.
Edit: As an added thought, I kind of like the idea of foundation rewards being separate and just for those who have put in the effort before the KS.
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@esoba said in Pre-Kickstarter Exclusives:
I really believe that design experiences are a wonderful funding option. Offer the ability to design a pet or weapon, charge a nice hefty fee. People love that stuff. Heck create a couple (very few) design experiences for world events or major bosses and you could sell those for an absolute premium.
Edit: As an added thought, I kind of like the idea of foundation rewards being separate and just for those who have put in the effort before the KS.
Yeah, PoE has done that many times over the years (and it was definitely a hefty sum) - those people worked with the devs to create in-game unique items.
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Is this game.on Kickstarter? I would back it if the rewards were good
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@markkdw Next month it will be.
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@Jetah I don't think peoples feedback will depend on how much they payed for access.
Particular person will provide feedback as he otherwise would, regardless of the package price. Someone who will provide good feedback will always provide good feedback, and vice versa.
Also, people who can afford pricier packages do not necessarily provide better feedback (or vice versa), this just does not depend on cash. This depends on how involved player is, and what kind of mindset he has.
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@gothix said in Pre-Kickstarter Exclusives:
@Jetah I don't think peoples feedback will depend on how much they payed for access.
Particular person will provide feedback as he otherwise would, regardless of the package price. Someone who will provide good feedback will always provide good feedback, and vice versa.
Also, people who can afford pricier packages do not necessarily provide better feedback (or vice versa), this just does not depend on cash. This depends on how involved player is, and what kind of mindset he has.
Part of it is pricing it out of majority trolls hands. There are many people that will buy a KS tier and refund it after a month or so. There are those that squat a tier too.
Sure there are exceptions to everything. There may be a few people that get a 15$ alpha tier and provide great feedback but majority will see it as a “play before everyone else”.
Consider how majority of teens don’t care for a car they’re given but those that buy their own tend to care more.
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@jetah All feedback (to an extent) is useful. Even what you called poor feedback is useful if people are agreeing with it. I don't think pricing should take into account what kind of feedback a player might give.
But what kickstarter pricing should try control for are player reviews. If you let a lot of people in that don't really care about the well-being of the game, they'll come in, see that the game is unfinished/unpolished or they didn't understand what kind of game they bought into, and go to reddit or whatever and trash talk the game. That's a lot more detrimental to the success of the game than just bad feedback.
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@jetah said in Pre-Kickstarter Exclusives:
I played today and it’s broke. Please fix.
How is that good feedback?
Cause at least they know it's broke then!
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@jetah said in Pre-Kickstarter Exclusives:
I played today and it’s broke. Please fix.
How is that good feedback?
That's a pretty ridiculous exaggeration of bad feedback. That specific feedback would be ignored. If it was "X is broke, please fix", and it was being echoed, then the devs would know that there's something wrong with X or players' perception of X.
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@kellewic I like how POE has done several packages over the years in different levels for their expansions and theme releases. I like having the option on how much I want to spend they typically had a basic level with an armor skin and some cash store credit and each level you go up costs more but also includes the items from the last level.
I've purchased several over the years just because I liked the armor skins. I usually opt out of any physical items but I did get a jacket on one of the packages.
I remember looking at the one package they had to work with the Devs on creating a monster. I never went for it but I thought about it
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if you've done any troubleshooting work then you'd know the person will never tell you what you need to know to fix the problem. on game forums they even forget to mention the platform they're on, what they've done, etc.
yep, they had a 10k tier where you developed a unique monster. i've spent about 1k with them so far for various packs.
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@jetah said in Pre-Kickstarter Exclusives:
if you've done any troubleshooting work then you'd know the person will never tell you what you need to know to fix the problem. on game forums they even forget to mention the platform they're on, what they've done, etc.
That's bug reporting, not feedback.
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@ladyrowan ok
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@gambles I agree for the most part. Although I also think it would be kinda nice to have KS rewards be a little different than foundation rewards.
