PvE Planet with PvP
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A lot of thoughts of PvP players why the PvE planet should be altered, is it only me who finds that Ironic?
I was going to type a long message of counter-arguments and information already available, but Specter's posts took away the need for that and altering Arboreus as it was only based on speculations.
Although I am a ini mini bit disappointed that most of the people in this discussion have a high foundation score, so all of the information Specter was giving, should have been known by you guys.
Arboreus is a PvE planet for good reasons, have you ever tried to keep your fur clean and in good condition, with all that human and demon blood on you? Not to mention the taste if you have to lick it off you.......
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@Farlander Keep in mind that at release we are going to have mounts, so we'll be able to travel a lot faster than we can do now.
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Ok if the argument that uncontested resource influx may or may not ruin the economy is received as a token of aggresion/greed/selfishness/generally being a prick and wanting to ruin others fun, then I will just distance myself from this convo. I don't get how all of a sudden I'm the agenda pushing bad guy in this scenario
Caring for the game's future has never been so frowned upon.
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@Razvan said in PvE Planet with PvP:
@Tuoni said in PvE Planet with PvP:
If demons could not travel to Arboreus how they would get access to unique resources or unlock certain abilities which need exploration to other planets?
I think they might not have access to those. I remember some time ago asking a similar thing on discord, and the response was that some content is restricted from demons. Then I asked if I can go demon -> angel -> demon and the answer was not because the angels can't lose karma.
There is always a small chance, that part of knowledge can be accessible to demons, through some event asteroids, so demons can reach the needed skills, without needing an ability to venture to Arboreus safe zone.
But directly, it will not be accessible, yes.
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@Tuoni That's not what I meant.
If you're selling a "Demon resource" from Tartaros, you don't have to worry that an Arboreus player is able to safely gather "Demon resource" on Arboreus as well because that resource is unique to Tartaros. With each planet having their own unique resources, nobody has to worry about everyone going to Arboreus to farm resources there because it's the safest planet. If someone wants Tartaros resources, they will have no choice but to go to Tartaros to gather it, or alternatively buy it from someone who did. No resource will be strictly better or worse though, just different. With that said, I do expect resources from dangerous areas to be more valuable than from safe areas.@Farlander You won't be able to explore all of Arboreus as an evil player, but I believe it will now be possible to unlock that knowledge elsewhere. I shall ask Prometheus what the current plan is for those unlocks.
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@Farlander As I understand it, the majority of Arboreus hard-bans characters of Evil alignment - they effectively die instantly upon entering these sacred zones. Evil characters are limited to a half hour or so in addition to only being permitted to enter a select few areas.
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@Razvan said in PvE Planet with PvP:
@Tuoni said in PvE Planet with PvP:
If demons could not travel to Arboreus how they would get access to unique resources or unlock certain abilities which need exploration to other planets?
I think they might not have access to those. I remember some time ago asking a similar thing on discord, and the response was that some content is restricted from demons. Then I asked if I can go demon -> angel -> demon and the answer was not because the angels can't lose karma.
I think they do UNLESS there is happen changes for the original plan. Here is a quote from Feature Spotlight #6. And yeah, angels are a special case an treatet as a permanent good characters.
"ARBOREUS
Arboreus Mood PaintingArboreus is designed to be the ideal home of PvE lovers. It features large areas accessible only by Beastmen and characters with Good alignment, and a great degree of protection from hostile PvP in the rest of the world. How great is such protection? Let’s go through that together.
First and foremost, travelling to Arboreus is no small feat for a Human or Demon character. It requires good planning and is generally expected to be a group effort. Moreover, and more importantly, things get exponentially more difficult for players of Neutral and Evil alignment, who not only have to work harder to gain access to the planet, but also find it harder to stay.
Indeed, only Humans with Good alignment are allowed to walk the lands of Arboreus for a considerable amount of time – 20/40 real-world hours, thus being able to explore a good portion of the world at once, collecting resources and acquiring knowledge.
If you’re a Human with Neutral alignment, you can also stay for a while – around 5/10 hours, penalized only by a slight stat debuff. However, if you get flagged as Aggressive, you are immediately treated as Evil, suffering all the penalties explained below.
If your character has an Evil alignment and you manage to enter Arboreus, well, now you’re in trouble! The planet itself, pervaded by the primal energy of Elysium, immediately starts fighting to repel you. You become heavily debuffed, and normally pacific creatures turn aggressive against you, seeking you out to rip you apart. Even worse, you are only allowed to stay on Arboreus for half an hour at once, and you are quickly drained of all vital energies if you step into a Good-only area."
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@Gothix said in PvE Planet with PvP:
there will always be players who will try to "push their own agenda" on "any side".
This happens too much.
PvP players wanting more PvP on Arboreus, and PvE players pushing for less PvP on other two planets.
Usually PvP players wants more PvP Arboreus because they want to kill players who do not want to PvP but rarely PvE players demand less PvP in other planets. I do not remember a single post where someone would demand less PvP e.g. in Tartaros but I remember several where people wants more PvP in Arboreus.
It's simply that part of people do not care for others, are selfish, and you can't expect any better from them.
But we trust that such players will not influence devs away from their vision.
From development point of view it would be much better if people could be as objective as possible and not just push their own agenda. It is important examine the discussed topic from the right audience pov, e.g. now when we are talking about PvP in Arboreus we have to remember that this planet is planned from the beginning to be content for PvE centric players. That is why PvP should not exist at all or it should be very limited. Most important is that those who want to avoid 100% PvP would also have that chance.
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@Tuoni Ok so I've said that I was going to restrain from doing this any further but there seems to have been a giant misunderstanding that has never been cleared or addressed by any party period.
I am not arguing for Arboreus to become a PvMer slaughterhouse, not at all. I am just stating my concern with how the uncontested influx of items may unpredictably affect the economy globally.
While yes, more PvP on Arb is a way to fix that, I myself do not support it as it really is intrusive and just plain douchey.
But with Specter dropping info that leads me to think that one won't be able to find any given resource on more then one planet, this concern may be no longer valid.
Let's just please get over it and shake hands/make love/whatever, doing this needless and pointless beef isn't fun for anyone involved.
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@Tuoni said in PvE Planet with PvP:
but rarely PvE players demand less PvP
Are you being serious here? :')
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@humerus Actually I did not think that you were pushing PvP in Arboreus and I guess this happened quite little in this thread anyway. This been more a problem in earlier discussions related to the same topic.
I remember that Syndesia is planned to be the center of trading and I guess most of the resources from Arboreus and Tartaros are transported there by inhabitant or humans. Therefore, it might be more usual way to get the different resources to buy those from Syndesia where demons and beastmen have easier access. However, it can be interesting have that opportunity to go gather those resources by yourself but with a very high risk.
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@Gothix said in PvE Planet with PvP:
@Tuoni said in PvE Planet with PvP:
but rarely PvE players demand less PvP
Are you being serious here? :')
Not with that, but you took that out of the context.
Here is the rest where I was referring:
"..but rarely PvE players demand less PvP in other planets. I do not remember a single post where someone would demand less PvP e.g. in Tartaros but I remember several where people wants more PvP in Arboreus."
There is a reason for this because PvE centric players are fine by that they have a PvE planet where they can live without PvP if they want to, and they do not care what happens e.g. in Tartaros because they do not have a motive to push
PvEless PvP there. However, some PvP players enjoys to kill defenseless players and chase down gatherers who do not fight back, and those players will try to promote PvP in Arboreus. Perhaps you are one them?
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@Tuoni there were posts where some players asked for "less PvP" in Syndesia though.
Don't have the will to search for those posts now, but there were asks for various "player and goods" protective mechanics, and similar.
I myself am aware players on both sides try to push own agenda, and I will personally never claim "only PvE players complain and ask" because I'm a realist.
I know "both sides" do want to push own agenda.One just needs to open his eyes to see it.
@Tuoni said in PvE Planet with PvP:
Perhaps you are one them?
A sign of "closed eyes" right there.
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@Gothix said in PvE Planet with PvP:
@Tuoni there were posts where some players asked for "less PvP" in Syndesia though.
Don't have the will to search for those posts now, but there were asks for various "player and goods" protective mechanics, and similar.
About Syndesia perhaps but that will be much more complex topic. If we talk about Arboreus and Tartaros, PvE and PvP, in that context PvP players are those who try to influence how Arboreus will be implemeted from PvP point of view. However, typically PvE centric players are not interested how things are going in Tartaros.
If we examine Syndesia, I am sure that there will be huge conversations ahead how the PvP should work there. At this moment it is impossible say how much there will be PvP because we have to wait and see (perhaps even in practice) how penalizing it will be to perform criminal actions. We know the frames for the rules but details are still missing like how much karma hit you take from a one kill, or how restrictive the life of criminal will actually be.
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yeah. we need more spotlights.
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@Specter said in PvE Planet with PvP:
You won't be able to explore all of Arboreus as an evil player, but I believe it will now be possible to unlock that knowledge elsewhere. I shall ask Prometheus what the current plan is for those unlocks.
I have confirmation from Prometheus that it indeed works like this now. Knowlegde that's locked behind safe zones will also be available somewhere else, so evil players don't have to worry about losing out on knowledge.
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I think some of the problem here is players want access to everything but want their own type of gameplay everywhere as well. As a player I've never wanted to miss out on content within a game. I'm one of those players that wants to do it all. I was maintaining 16 characters in SWTOR which was way more than I should have but I didn't want to miss out on any of the story arcs.
I think if the planets would have been mirrored like it was in UO with just having different pvp rulesets there might have been less arguing. However. that would completely change the idea the devs had for their game. As players we need to accept their vision.
Personally I'm glad they added the different planets. I probably won't visit the demon planet and will live mostly in the beast one but that is my choice and I'm glad I have that choice
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@Specter I hope they do the same for the pvp planet because even though it is not hardlocked from players it is in effect locked out from players who just do not have the physically capability to play in the fast paced pvp gamestyle. This is something you 20 year olds will not understand until you get older lol.
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@Specter said in PvE Planet with PvP:
@Tuoni That's not what I meant.
If you're selling a "Demon resource" from Tartaros, you don't have to worry that an Arboreus player is able to safely gather "Demon resource" on Arboreus as well because that resource is unique to Tartaros. With each planet having their own unique resources, nobody has to worry about everyone going to Arboreus to farm resources there because it's the safest planet. If someone wants Tartaros resources, they will have no choice but to go to Tartaros to gather it, or alternatively buy it from someone who did. No resource will be strictly better or worse though, just different. With that said, I do expect resources from dangerous areas to be more valuable than from safe areas.If all resources are different in every planet then there will not be that much (or at all) problems. However, if same resources can be gathered from several planets that will shake the balance of markets. And yeah, I also expect resources from dangerous areas be more valueable.
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@Yitra said in PvE Planet with PvP:
A lot of thoughts of PvP players why the PvE planet should be altered, is it only me who finds that Ironic?
Arboreus is a PvE planet for good reasons, have you ever tried to keep your fur clean and in good condition, with all that human and demon blood on you? Not to mention the taste if you have to lick it off you.......Actually if you read the whole discussion there is not much promoting PvP on Arboreus more than what is planned from developers behalf. People are more like trying to figure out how the limited PvP will be implemented. At the moment all we know is very high level stuff and we do not have that much concreteness.
I can admit that I am most likely going to play a human as my main character, however, I am also going to create a beastmen alt for gathering and to play special PvE content what is not available for humans. Perhaps I am not the core audience of Arboreus but maybe nevertheless close enough to make reasonable and objective suggestions.
Anyway, I would actually like to hear from those who are planning to play mainly on Arboreus, how they imagine the PvP should be implemented in the PvE planet? Or is the original plan from devs behalf too much from the beginning and there should not be PvP at all?
