PVE loot mechanics
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@Kralith I couldn't find english version anymore, but you will understand this one.
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I personally love the Guild Wars 2 loot system. Everyone participating gets their own loot and this even counts for harvesting nodes, so there is no rush to who get's to the harvest node 1st.
This also prevents a race for the DPS who can do the most damage to get the loot, and prevents trolls with high DPS from killing off NPC's a low DPS player engages in and preventing them from getting any loot.
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@Gothix Haha, yes, Shakes and Fidget told us always the truth
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@EvolGrinZ said in PVE loot mechanics:
I personally love the Guild Wars 2 loot system. Everyone participating gets their own loot and this even counts for harvesting nodes, so there is no rush to who get's to the harvest node 1st.
This also prevents a race for the DPS who can do the most damage to get the loot, and prevents trolls with high DPS from killing off NPC's a low DPS player engages in and preventing them from getting any loot.That is fine in a cooperative PvE games.
But in a PvP enabled games where competition around resources is one of key factors, that type of looting system simply does not fit in.
Those other games have other measurement / reward systems. Which team is able to clear this dungeon, or that raid, and for this accomplishment then a whole group gets rewarded.
Fractured is based around resource systems, resources are used to trade, gain gold, build gear, craft everything, and there is no classic dungeon / raid systems.
This is why resources have to be competed factor, and not a shared factor, otherwise Fractured could very well be made into a full PvE game.
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We should all remember too, loot doesn't really matter as compared to games that have been mentioned, thus far. It seems to me that knowledge and resources(collected through harvesting or stealing) will be far more important, neither of which require a loot system.
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This requires a simple solution. Just give me (or any other cool beans person) all the loot.
If that is not satisfactory then I think people should squabble amongst themselves on how the loot should be divided. As that way the loot gained becomes more valuable.
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@Crowdac said in PVE loot mechanics:
We should all remember too, loot doesn't really matter as compared to games that have been mentioned, thus far. It seems to me that knowledge and resources(collected through harvesting or stealing) will be far more important, neither of which require a loot system.
Knowledge alone won't protect you nor kill enemies. you'll need gear to increase your damage as the stats should affect ability numbers.
@EvolGrinZ
That could work on the Beast planet but would give them a huge advantage in PvP (as they'd have more raw resources being a coop planet). I'm all for some struggles but I'd want the distribution of resources to be equal. IE if one beast nodes can give 25 raw resources but the equivalent human/demon only gives 3 then there's a problem. Only balance I can think of for that is the beast would need 25 per item whereas the demon/human would need 1-3.or I just wait for you to harvest it then kill you for it
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The game is a unique concept, and so I should imagine the loot system will have to be unique too. And competition over resources could be a great pvp driver, and in those terms some sort of tiering could be a way to have people with equal power or experience fighting over the resources required to upgrade. Making pvp progression = pve progression will be interesting though because pve you don't have nearly the same risk. But it is also possible the game will feature different systems for each of the planets. Or as mentioned above, pve worlds requiring more resources for the same progression.
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The looting of the group can be varied, say what a wolf drops 20 claws, 1 leather, 3 meats and 10 teeth, when the group kill him , these items will be randomly distributed, for example, I can get 5 claws, 3 teeth and 1 meat, while my partner can receive equal or different items in large amounts or even smaller than mine.
Obs: I do not know if I could explain it correctly, but anything I'll fix later.
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Ideally looting will be none too important in the long run (overall, as each person will get enough to do what they wish). I say that with the following caveat: IF they wish to make a really solid, top end, unique crafting system, where crafters have their own knowledge system, setups, and specific reasons for the people more focused on adventuring out to utilize their services...
Simply put, if the game doesn't have a reason to have people focusing on crafting, the loot system needs to leave it easy enough to get your stuff. That can mean the basic stuff is easy, mid grade is a little harder, and top end is very difficult, but it must be feasible to have decent stuff for all at that point. On the other hand, if it does support that it needs to make the crafting enough of a focus that people actually care to use those services. In general that means a large number of crafts, with skill setups that make different variants and looks, and so on. It's likely more ambitious than the current goal, just to be honest.
So given what we currently know, I'm leaning to the loot grind not being so painful as to drive people away. Ideally each beastie will have certain resources, and the group itself can set the loot system up (one person harvests everything, group all gets a portion, group takes turns on each kill, etc.)
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@Jairone said in PVE loot mechanics:
(one person harvests everything, group all gets a portion, group takes turns on each kill, etc.)
I like that but I don't see the point in taking turns? If everyone gets some when a harvester harvests, why would you need to take turns?
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Another problem I see, especially for the beast world, when resources are single use and spawn in the same locations all the time, that there will be bots running a route and harvesting the nodes almost as soon as they spawn.
The nodes are a good PvP driver indeed, but you can't PvP on the beast world.
Perhaps have each world have a unique looting system for the nodes.
Beast World: Nodes can be harvested once per day per player, but don't disappear, so everyone can harvest them. The nodes will only give 1-3 items per harvest.
Demon World: Nodes can only be harvested once every hour and will disappear when harvested. The nodes will give 25-50 items per harvest.
Human World: Nodes can be harvested 3 times, after that it will disappear and will respawn after an hour. The nodes will give 5-15 items per harvest.A system somewhat like that seems fair and balanced to me and caters to the nature of the planet. Demon planet being selfish, and beast world being in harmony with nature and not taking more than you need kind of mentality.
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@Pwnstar Everyone has their own preferences. I just noted a number of possible options off the top of my head. It's really not anything new, many games use the idea in PvE.
So each different idea is essentially a different way of handling the RNG. Some people might not like the 'all get a portion' since the RNG might constantly give you what you don't want. So thus comes into play the everyone gets all the loot in turn method. Thus guaranteeing you the full amount of stuff, but only on your turn. It's merely a different method of dividing the goods. Of course, there's room for hybrid ideas and the like.
For example, a hybrid of the two would be that the group gets an initial 'resource type' assigned to each player from a kill (split between each type, and balanced across the group, such that all resources are counted and all members have a type as needed). So for a small group you'd have multiple resources per person, and in a large group multiple people per resource (in the second case, there should be primary, secondary, etc. ranks so that resources that are limited in number go out to people in turn). Then the taking turns part can kick in, where once people have gotten a resource they move to the next resource type.
Essentially it means you will get some part of the loot like in the portion plan, but also that you get a turn on type, preventing the portion from always being what you don't need/want.
I personally tend to like simple solutions, but not everyone does. RNG is always a big point of contention, as is fairness. A few options that are not too difficult to set is a good thing for mitigating that.
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@EvolGrinZ said in PVE loot mechanics:
Another problem I see, especially for the beast world, when resources are single use and spawn in the same locations all the time, that there will be bots running a route and harvesting the nodes almost as soon as they spawn.
The nodes are a good PvP driver indeed, but you can't PvP on the beast world.
Perhaps have each world have a unique looting system for the nodes.
Beast World: Nodes can be harvested once per day per player, but don't disappear, so everyone can harvest them. The nodes will only give 1-3 items per harvest.
Demon World: Nodes can only be harvested once every hour and will disappear when harvested. The nodes will give 25-50 items per harvest.
Human World: Nodes can be harvested 3 times, after that it will disappear and will respawn after an hour. The nodes will give 5-15 items per harvest.A system somewhat like that seems fair and balanced to me and caters to the nature of the planet. Demon planet being selfish, and beast world being in harmony with nature and not taking more than you need kind of mentality.
That's a pretty cool thought, although how difficult it may be to make would be a solid question. I'm of the opinion that bots will always be a problem, with the best method of countering them being a mix of PvE enemies and good investigation of methods/patterns (aka, catching them in the act).
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@Jairone i think bots won't be that much of a problem if this game don't go on the p2w route (which seems not to be the case).
Albion Online did well on that purpose with the premium + other features that makes botting absolutely not worth it.
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@OwlsaneGaming said in PVE loot mechanics:
Albion Online did well on that purpose with the premium + other features that makes botting absolutely not worth it.
half of AO population was, and i guess still is, bots.
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Perhaps players can report bots and sufficient numbet of reports would turn them into FFA target regardless of the planet they are on.
Organized false reporting would obviously bring consequences to reporters.
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@Gothix said in PVE loot mechanics:
Perhaps players can report bots and sufficient numbet of reports would turn them into FFA target regardless of the planet they are on.
Yeah, that won't be abused at all. lol
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@grofire oh come on, don't put that in this way LUL
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@Gothix said in PVE loot mechanics:
Perhaps players can report bots and sufficient numbet of reports would turn them into FFA target regardless of the planet they are on.
Organized false reporting would obviously bring consequences to reporters.
if you want me to roll a Beastkin.. that's how you do it!
