Aminal Tamer as a Class
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@althalus said in Aminal Tamer as a Class:
@boogis said in Aminal Tamer as a Class:
g slowing down your ping anyway. how they gonna enter horses in the game? same like Albion? selling from stupid merchant who get it from no one know from where? most likely they put wild horses on feilds and forestes nad allow players to tame them. So im asking you. whats a difference between wild horse and tamed horse? no bloody difference. server still have to work on both.
first of all "Dude" doesnt matter how great the developer is more characters are going to put a stress on the server that fact you think they wont and people can magically just add as many items as they wont just shows how much you know about game design. also there is a difference between wild horses somewhere off screen and the 1k different horses that show up at the same time on your screen in town thats why pretty much every game has atleast some lag issue when you enter town compared to the wilds...
oh camaaan Dude ))) you are not listening what im saying to you? if you leave your horse somewhere in the city anyone can ride it and take away from you, becouse its a horse, you know, horse there wont be 1000 of horses in town cos if you leave your horse unattended someone will steal it from you so u must put it in stable if you wanna keep it. or maybe there will by some temp stables near every building like a parking. so if you come to visite some taver and wanna grab some beer, just park your bloody horse in a safe place. but its stupid if you meet some enemies in a wild and you jump off horse and it dissapears, what a hell? i can tell you. its not that i try to prove my point but the thing is that if game braking simple logic and basic physics then its star to be ennoying. sireously. its work on subcotiouse level. people dont realize it but it does. ofcourse you dont have to make game too real but dissapearing horse doesnt make sense. unkillable horse doesnt make sense. why it dissapears? is it magic? why u cant kill it? is it a God? and soon or later such game will be ruined. cos all these nonsens got notised by our subcontiouse and soon or later we stop playing such game and we dont know why. i want this game be for longer cos i like it.
so when you have such a system of horse sharing you dont need 1000 of horses overcrowding a town if you have 1000 horses that means that 1000 player do some of their stuff and they dont care if the horse get stolen. but if DEVs will make different horses and mounts players wouldnt want to share them so they will leave it at stable. simple as that. also if you dont feed horse it will die so if there are 1000 roaming horses in a city they will die say in one day. if horse stay in wild then its servive.
so what im suggesting that horse should be like a resource. if your horse dissapear then you can put it in inventory = you can have multiple horses in inventory then amount of horses increas a lot. but they are not in the world. they are in stores. no one use them. in my concept horse will be like a resourse, they will spawn rarly once you found a horse you must not lose your chance and tame it and then you can bread it. maybe if there will be like a breading period so that you cant bread horse forever like in albion which is really annoying. (im seak of doing endless bloody meaninful breeading) you would have to bread for a while then go and look for new wild horse. that will make more sense and also will ad more veriety to the game. (not bloody grind)
also to prevent that we could charge tax for having a horse. like in real life with cars. this will suit my concept of horses in the world. so there wont be like 1000 of horses in your chest which is nonsense but you will have to think twice if your wanna have second horse? do you realy need two? if you got killed and lost your horse just go and buy another. why you keep 1000 of horse in your chest if you can just support local buisiness? if you have two horses then you must be a breeder and you make money out of it so you can offord to have two horses.
people must buy a new horse they must pay a tax for horse they must pay a stable man to look after horse. so there are not to many horses will be in a open world. besides, is there a difference for servers if its a horse in the world and if its horse under rider? please tell me.
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@specter said in Aminal Tamer as a Class:
@boogis Prometheus talked about mounts in the
. In short, mounts can't die and they will disappear when the rider dismounts.yes i have read that thats why i added some additiional info to my original post since its almost the same topic.
also i know that DEVs are sort of desided already but gama is still in pre alpha so they may change their opinion if they see what we as a community think about this. thats why i raise this subject to descuss. Am i wrong? Do DEVs care at all what we are writing here? If they just dont give a damn just they should say so and i will stop writing my crap. i just wanna this game to be better cos i like what you guys doing and i dont want you to be like some other boring games.
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@boogis The developers do read suggestions. I merely gave a clarification on how it currently works.
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@specter said in Aminal Tamer as a Class:
@boogis The developers do read suggestions. I merely gave a clarification on how it currently works.
Thank you for your help, but Muker already gave me all info by PM (good guy) thats why i raised this topic. I was surprised how people with such a revolutionary concept will allow immortal mounts and make them dissapear. Im not pushing on you, but really? We had it for long time already, maybe its a time to do something different, trust me, when game feel different from all other games you wanna play it more. You had this concept of three races, and just based on this i wanna play you game, but if there will be more new stuff i will play it even longer, trust me, you dont have to make it btp you can make it subscription based as long as it realy revolutionary. I dont care for 10-15 dollars a month as long as a have fun and play somethinf new. I invested a lots if money in albion while i was having fun. Its not fun anymore cos there is nothing to do, its boring grind. Give me something new a will pay you endlessly. But not like in Wow. They produse new content and make you previouse achivements meaningless. The way how to make people play your game is to give them endless money and power. Thats all you have to do.
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@althalus said in Aminal Tamer as a Class:
first of all "Dude" doesnt matter how great the developer is more characters are going to put a stress on the server
Fractured uses SpatialOS which scales server resources based on demand. Theoretically, Fractured should be able to handle thousands of players/entities in one area without any slow down.
@boogis said in Aminal Tamer as a Class:
I was surprised how people with such a revolutionary concept will allow immortal mounts and make them dissapear. Im not pushing on you, but really? We had it for long time already, maybe its a time to do something different, trust me, when game feel different from all other games you wanna play it more.
It's a matter of cost/time. The original plan seemed to include taming and deeper mount mechanics but these are fairly complex systems and would add significant development costs and cause them to miss their deadlines which they already seem to have trouble meeting. It's arguable if these systems would add more value than they'd cost; game development is still a business after all.
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@target im agree. But shall we wait a bit longer for better game or sooner get a copy of all other games. Besides they could just make it as a patch after release, like albion did. They also fixed disapearing mounts after release, but not quite. This guys says that all other games have concept of disapearing mounts not just Albion. So what? If everyone jump off the balcony shall i also do it? Someone has to stop it. Trust, me if they do something diffrent everyine will say - wow!! Finaly someone changed common rule, lets try it. People play different games for something different. Thats a law!! :)))
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@boogis said in Aminal Tamer as a Class:
I have read your Q&A about mounts and im very disapointed. Im not the one who give mentored advices to DEVs but i try to use common sense. What you guys have said about mounts is complitly copy of Albion Online,.
You said that mount is disapearing after you get off it. Its very unrealistic, it would be much better if mount would not be able to put in inventory like a some sort of item. Mount is mount. It will be better if it will never dissapear and it will always had to stay in a world and if you got off mount it will be always standind where you left it untill some one killed it. yes!! killed it. mount like a players. good player? good mount. bad player bad mount. you killed it? then deal with karma issues.Hi boogis! The first iteration of mounts is going to work in that "simplified" way simply because it's quick to make (budget matters!) and because we won't have animal taming yet. It's not intended to stay like that forever.
As you can see, animal taming is one of our stretch goals. Being a stretch goal means it's not a core feature of the game, but one we'd love to see nonetheless. If unlocked, we're going to work on it later on in the development cycle - perhaps in late alpha, perhaps in beta. Once that's completed, you'll be able to tame pets, issue them orders and of course attack other people's pets. That will include mounts!
@boogis said in Aminal Tamer as a Class:
Also fight on mounts its a lot of fun but if you put it right. maybe if you sit on mounts you cannot use your special abilities but only auto-attacks. so it can be simple kick from warrior simple shot from archer and simpliest spell from mage or even just a staff strike. why you complitly decline this possiablity? game should be more very.
It's very, very unlikely we're ever going to have mounted combat for several reasons - the two largest ones being it would require a lot of work (particularly on the animation side) and that it would be a balancing nightmare. All our combat is designed and balanced to be between walking characters, and trust me we have a ton of more important features to develop than mounted combat which is really out of the scope of the game
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@prometheus
That’s what expansions or content patches are for!I’d love to see mounted combat for the main reason it isn’t prevalent in video games.
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@azraelius I would also like to see it unlocked too. Taming animals to be mounts, combat pets, house pets, farm animals would be really fun. I
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@prometheus ofcourse as developer you know what us better in terms of developing, but im a gamer and i look at this from gamer perspective. Maybe not every gamer will agree with me but i see it very cool when you ride your own dragon and burn your enemies down with gragons fire. Also if you fight on horses i cant see balancing problem. Yes, you are faster but you can only strike with basic abilty. Remeber how annoying its in albion when you cant catch your target cos its on a mount. There u must get of your horse and wait like few seconds to be able to attack your target. So its almost impossible to kill someone on a mount. But if there was a mount fight you could have attack on the go. Maybe not deal too much damage, just a little bit, but it would be good for balance, and people have to choose either they want big damage being on feet on a little bit but being on horse. Balance will still be, cos if you wanna proper fight you must dismount. But may be you enemy want you no escape and they will kill your horse. Also you cant run far far away and then jump on a horse and escape, you have to stick to the area where you left you horse. This means if u realy wanna engage then its your final choice. Cos most likely if u dismount you will stay where u are or run without horse and if enemy is still on horse there is no way to escape cos of mount fight.
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@boogis @Prometheus
Mounted combat could be a knowledge tree set. Then there's the anti-mount knowledge tree set (or some skills added to the existing groups). Crafting potential is there too. Saddles, stirrups, bolas, etc. Some ranks of spells/abilities could dismount players. An option to target the mount or player could be introduced (skill shots i know but there's still an axis to aim low or high). Then there's food, maintenance, etc.I'd make mounted combat pretty expensive within the game economy. That would be the balance I'd strive for. They're powerful on the field but if you lose one then you're out a few (this is high) gold.
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@jetah yes yes. I wanted to to suggest it too, but i forgot. Mount fight could be like a skill. They call it lancer or something. But anti-lancer could be a spear. It will dismount a lancer. Thats pritty cool :))) so its balance. u wanna protect from mount fights? just bring someone with a spear with you
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Mounted combat could make an interesting way to dual someone. An earlier post talked about mini games.. there could be an actual coliseum with leader boards for jousting. I love dreaming big
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@boogis
there's more to mounted combat than just pikes. Nearly every weapon and spell could be used on a mount.Now getting the mount comfortable with your attacks.. Oh that's the secret.
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Given my experiences with mounted combat in Wurm Online, I'm totally onboard -not- having it in Fractured.
Horses are always the first targets (because anyone on foot is basically dead, despite spears), so everyone brings extra, and the field is littered with horse corpses.
Gearing up all those horses for the grinder is a pain (barding/saddles/horseshoes), not to mention the effort required to breed them or get the skill required to tame and ride the best mounts (hell horses), which have themselves proved unbalancing (they allow far too rapid logistical response times, for one thing).
So, I think I'd just prefer foot combat.
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@roccandil well, lets get rid of full loot then ) cos its a pain to get all your gear. lets make players lose nothing. if players lose nothing then lets get rid of pve zones/planets cos player lose nothing anyway so why not free pvp? devs want us to think twice before involving in fights and loosing your horse can be one of option to achive that.
@jetah said in Aminal Tamer as a Class:
@boogis
there's more to mounted combat than just pikes. Nearly every weapon and spell could be used on a mount.Now getting the mount comfortable with your attacks.. Oh that's the secret.
yes not only spears but spear could be like anti-mount weapon, this could be for warriors but also mages could have a special spell and archers as well.
the main idea for balance what i suggest is that you will deal lot less damage on mount then on feet. so you would have to choose either you wanna keep your horse (and run away/fight) or you wanna jump on your feet and fight in full straighth. what is your oppinion? isnt it a balance which would help?
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i added poll in my first messege so please vote if u like
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@boogis
As I see it, mounted combat:- makes PvP harder to balance;
- increases the speed of travel (effectively making maps smaller);
- for the cost of development, ultimately adds relatively little unique gameplay (in my experience, everyone -has- to be mounted, so you've simply relocated the combat framework, not expanded it).
All the same, I agree it would be nice if done right, but I think the cost outweighs the gain.
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@roccandil ok my replys:
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its not hard to balance if you give dismounted players more damage deal on others (so everyone choose to dismount) , plus some dismounting features like in albion when if you attack mounted person you are killing his horse (or not killing but just dismounting)
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you are using horses anyway, why it makes map smaller? u r suggesting not use mounts at all to make map bigger? besides when you fight on mount you are not in motion, you are standing still and moving only your weapon.
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if this idea is very little unique why you say it cost a lots of development? not logical. more unique then more development it cost isnt it? i did not relocate anything, (as far as i see) there will be both mounted and dismaounted combats, its only adding more tactics. like stan. if you are on horse you can be stanned and then your hourse will be killed and then what you are gonna do? or maybe not killed but you will be dismounted so you have to fight on your feet at that moment enemies will focus on your horse so that you never mount again untill they kill you. in fact people will try to evoid to do mounted combat cos they have big chnace of loosing it so befor fight they might leave it in a safe place or maybe risk it, it doesnt matter, cos fight its something big and you can lose your gear and your horse.
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With such a small team constructing the game I would rather have them flesh out and make the regular combat perfect... Polished.
Mounted combat can be something explored later on once the game is running well not?
So many systems and game mechanics are more important to be focused on.
