Few In-Game Suggestions
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- Health bars should be about double their size. Its really kinda hard to see when your health is going down because its so small. Length i mean. Increase it from left to right about double size or allow them to be moved to other parts of the screen and increased in size or both.
- Knowledge points should take 4 to 5 times longer to acquire. After playing the game for 2 days I already have all the skills I need to have a complete character. Thats just way to short. MMO's should always have some type of grind.
If you want to see an MMO that had no grind that was a complete failure go check out crowfall. - New players constantly ask why they can't make certain products at the work benches. Its a really dumb dynamic to limit people from making items to just being in a city or part of a city. What if instead of restrictions you just charge them a traveler or visitor fee for using the bench that a portion of the tax goes to the city governor or is a gold sink?
- You should be able to transfer and or sell your house. Not just abandon it.
- How bout some lockable front doors? Cause when i'm carrying my 10 ingots doing my crafting i dont want to get butt stuffed by some pk.
Thats it for now all. Hope these recommendations make sense. Also i should note. I dont give a flying monkey what the "Original intent" of the developers was. I want creative solutions to stupid issues.
-Bitter LordsofDeath.com
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Never thought about that, but you could be right.
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Fractured is marketed as allowing you to be competitive from the get go, and working on the chars only unlocks options for it, doesn't make it grow vertically. This is the first alpha to actually deliver that promise.
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That's how it actually works for residents. They pay taxes to use the facilities. Citiziens have it for free.
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Agree
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You can't be attacked inside your plot.
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As to the 2nd point, this being a shorter Alpha test, they have more than likely accelerated the KP build as we have limited time to play.
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2: also keep in mind you have to have a wide variant of builds/abilities to progress further in the game because of the mobs resistances and stuff, so later on with the other bioms aswell you have to be prepared with the right equip and skills for certain mobs and areas
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2 - Yes, but a complete re-tooling should be necessary... I'd settle with a "knowledge" system for acquiring skills, but a general experience system for "leveling up" with perks and such. A separate crafting level would be nifty too!
3 - Agreed. Certain technologies/infrastructure should only be available to cities, no doubt there, but possibly change the way resource gathering works? I would suggest doing away with this cart nonsense... I get that it is "immersive", but it very much hinders what could be done with the mechanics.
Example: players may come across mining nodes and hold that metal in their own inventories, smelt it at their own property, and forge it at a city blacksmith.
Secondly here, research should be done on a personal level, not on a city level. Pushing that level of dependency scares away new players/solo players.
4 - This is obviously a yes.
5 - Yep. Also remove the stupid carting system... It feels very tedious; change carts to allow the carrying of more material instead (massively increased weight capacity).
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They have said that that is one system they definitely DON'T want. the whole primary goal of Fractured is to be a Horizontal Progression game, not a Vertical Leveling system with Experience. This they have said was a hard line, and you definitely won't get. To give this to you would be to violate the promise they made during Kickstarter.
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Actually, even on your own plot, you pay a gold cost for things.
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They purposely don't want people to be able to transfer houses. They want every home-owner to have to go through the build process. At least other players can help you build, but if the plot of land goes to someone else, a whole new build phase needs to happen.
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The Cart system fits exactly into the planned gameplay of Fractured. They want to have some 'tedious' things in the game, and they want to differentiate between light load items (gathered reagents, food, rope, clothing, etc...) and large construction items (Ore, Stone, Wood Logs, Resource Stacks.) This is purely on purpose, so don't expect it to change too much. They have made some small adjustments, and I, for one, would love to see something where you could take like 100 of a light item, bag it at the bagging station, then load it into a cart or wagon.
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Most productive and feedback since i've been on the forums. Good stuff all. I appreciate the comments and thoughtful feedback!
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1- While having the majority of the game be horizontal in nature, an ideal is balance is found with vertical progression. It allows for significant player diffusion in terms of goals/ability that otherwise wouldn't occur due to the homogenous, pure horizontal progression.
Example: Players who make swords create better swords after a long time of "mastering" the craft. Players who make Staffs master their craft... Make the progression for each one very lengthy to incentivize player specialization, and the economy would become even more trade centered.
2- What are you responding to? I numbered my responses by OPs suggestions; you are confusing me. I was only mentioning carts being a silly system as is, and a potential change to resource gathering as a change.
3- You should be able to sell property, developed and undeveloped. Because the precious trade economy would enable it and flourish because of it. See real estate IRL for examples. Hell, maybe increase the amount of plots that can be owned to 2, to allow flipping of properties should players want to.
4- Just because something is planned doesn't mean it fits well with the game. Gameplay can be tweaked to make the game more enjoyable, for us, and new players too. Games only succeed if the player base is large enough, or wealthy enough.
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@BECKFAST
I can' t remember what I was responding to with 2, and I looked. Sorry about that, maybe I'll see it in the future. [edit] Okay, I found it, I was actually responding to 3. up above about charging a fee, and I was pointing out they are actually doing that already for home owners.[/edit]As to 1. The Goal as the developers stated, for this game, was to not have that player diffusion. They want diffusion to be tied to just gear and build, not how long you've been playing. They expect everyone to max out KP fairly quickly, and then play around with different builds and party makeups for everything else. In other words, they are dedicated to the idea that a brand new player can enter the game, get loaned a set of gear, and completely on par, power-wise to everyone else in their 2 to 3 year old party. They might not have as many options (less gear to choose from, less skills and talents unlocked for various builds) but even just the starter skills and a decent set of comparable gear can make them fight alongside their companions and actually contribute fairly equally.
There is talk about some skill related talents, but they have as yet not found any talents for skills that fit the overall feel they want Fractured to have. They did however make the promise that beginners could compete right off the bat, so any real vertical progression would violate that promise.
As to 3, we'll have to agree to disagree. The developers want anyone owning property to have to work for more than just the gold to get it. Same reason personal plots can't be invaded and taken. They want you to have to build your property from the ground up. No just straight transfers. Yes, it is one type of economy they could encourage, but it is one they aren't interested in pursuing.
- By planned, I mean it fits well with the developers's concept of how they want the game to go. Yes, just because its planned doesn't mean it fits your idea of what you would like to see, however, it is exactly on par with what others want from the game.
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@GamerSeuss It's proven to be a pretty general rule throughout human existence: If there is nothing to move forward to that benefits you directly, why bother? Having a certain amount of vertical progression (namely in crafting, as I believe combat should largely be horizontal + knowledge) would help give players an incentive to keep playing whilst providing newer players opportunities with their crafted goods.
Something too man people don't understand: Complete shakeups of previously proven systems are NOT always good, and often turn out horribly.
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@BECKFAST Giving goals is good, they don't always have to be progression goals.
Late game, Fractured is going to rely on their Asteroid Content to satisfy the need for new goals to motivate players.
In addition to that, whether you agree or not about complete shakeups of previous systems, the point here is that it was a fundemental core promise of the game from its Kickstarter launch. That means they are pretty much locked into this particular concept in order to satisfy what advanced backers paid for. There is a lot of room for interpretation, however anything that was flat out promised in the Kickstarter launch, such as a dedication to Horizontal Progression, where power creep is not going to be a focus of the game, can only really be sacrificed if it becomes something they simply cannot do, not just something they change their minds on. That is One of the big things when it comes to Kickstarter backing. You are obligated to live up to your Kickstarter promises, or fail to deliver.
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@GamerSeuss Success or failure, time will tell if the system works. I am of the opinion that players need personal progression goals as well as personal feats, and I firmly believe that is the case in RPGS/life in general.
Time will tell.
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Some sort of verticality must be there, I agree. That said, you can put in just the right amount for your system.
If a typical game takes you from 1 to 1 milion from early game to end game, a game like Fractured can take you from 1 to 1.5 from early game to end game.
It is still a goal, it is still progression. Just not as explosive as vertical progression games.
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@spoletta I completely agree. I am not proposing such a stupid level of power change from start and finish, but a modest amount that leads to player continuation. I don't understand why people always bring strawman arguments into these sorts of things... Hell, too much water would kill you too.
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@GamerSeuss said in Few In-Game Suggestions:
@BECKFAST
To give this to you would be to violate the promise they made during Kickstarter.i do not know when you joined the game, i was here before the kickstarter, and as i see the game now they violate a lot from what they promised.
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@grofire They may have made some changes from what they said pre-Kickstarter, but that doesn't violate anything.
Once they started taking investment money (Kickstarter) they pretty much set a level of expectation that they have to think LONG and HARD about changing. Money has changed hands, so now the investors (Kickstarter backers) can expect to be consulted directly if any major promise of the game at that point is being considered to be changed. As the main promise of Fractured, probably central to most backers, was the ability for a brand new player, gear aside, to be able to stand side by side with a 2 year old player and each do meaningful contributions to a battle. Any vertical growth must therefore be very very miniscule at best to meet this criteria.They also promised that the KP system would not simply be another Experience Point system by another name.
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@GamerSeuss said in Few In-Game Suggestions:
@grofire They may have made some changes from what they said pre-Kickstarter, but that doesn't violate anything.
Once they started taking investment money (Kickstarter) they pretty much set a level of expectation that they have to think LONG and HARD about changing. Money has changed hands, so now the investors (Kickstarter backers) can expect to be consulted directly if any major promise of the game at that point is being considered to be changed. As the main promise of Fractured, probably central to most backers, was the ability for a brand new player, gear aside, to be able to stand side by side with a 2 year old player and each do meaningful contributions to a battle. Any vertical growth must therefore be very very miniscule at best to meet this criteria.They also promised that the KP system would not simply be another Experience Point system by another name.
lets set the record straight about 2 points:
1 - they already violate what they say in the kickstarter, since they talked about the grind:Levels, skills, achievements. These classic progression patterns always have one thing in common: the grind. In Fractured, an innovative take on horizontal progression allows you to enjoy the freedom and level playing field of a MOBA without losing the persistence and sense of progression of a real MMO.
and every one that played this test know that the grind is real, and its crystal clear for whom that play solo!
2 - horizontal progression does not mean you can't have vertical achievements, its your wild assumption that all must be equal.
and let me show example how they could have done this:
a player go on the wild and find a monster and killed her, he will get all the skills and knowledge about that monster ( NO GRIND ), this skill have 3 level of power, to get this levels, the player need to find the places and do some tasks.
this way they have what they promised, no grind, and reward exploration while still have vertical achievements.the main issue that all the people talking about horizontal progression forgot, its the reason for the horizontal progression, the NO GRIND, its not that they wanted to remove vertical achievements!
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@grofire They are trying to strike the balance so it doesn't feel like a grind.
In a game with grind, you can keep killing the same mobs over and over again, until you level out of them. In Fractured, each mob has a finite amount of KP and number of skills they unlock. If you didn't kill all the weak mobs you needed to go 100% in the beginning of your career, you can go back and quickly finish those, once better decked out in gear. No grind really. There is a huge difference between repetitive killing being required to learn all there is to know about something with a hard limit, and GRINDING your way through mobs for hours and hours to accumulate a few more experience points.
The closest thing to a real grind, in Fractured, is totally voluntary, and that's grinding for Gold or Materials. Other games require the grind, as well as meaningless fetch quests and such to get you anywhere, Fractured got rid of meaningless quests, and made any grinding finite, and thus not really grindy...however, still manages to reward those people with gold/materials who actively want to go out and farm for stuff.
I hear so many people complain about it, and yes, in this test, they have the numbers set a little off from what everyone is saying, I'm not going to say they don't, but that's only because they are trying to get to the right balance with progression of knowledge between too fast (what Players heavily complained about previously, maxing out KP way too early in the game) and too slow (having to kill some hard to find and highly contended mobs 50 times to get to 100%). I have faith that they will continue to adjust the slider until a happy medium is reached, so it isn't grindy, but also isn't handed to people without any effort whatsoever.
I never said all must be 'equal' I said that a brand new player, and a 2 year old veteran, both naked or in the same gear, should have pretty much the same effectiveness against the mobs out there. The only real difference, and this is vertical over horizontal progress, is that the veteran has more options about how they go about it. They've unlocked more skills, so can use different movesets, but all the relative power is the same, give or take (it is hard to go exactly the same, of course, but by giving a decent set of starter skills to everyone at character creation, you may never need to unlock another skill if you don't want to. Same with Talents)
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@GamerSeuss i hear what you say, and as i said i do not mind bending the kickstarter terms and get little, or finite as you called it, grind, since we see it is needed.
and since we see it is needed, now you need to understated that its the same for horizontal progression, the game can't be full horizontal progression, since that just boring... and:I never said all must be 'equal' I said that a brand new player, and a 2 year old veteran, both naked or in the same gear, should have pretty much the same effectiveness against the mobs out there. The only real difference, and this is vertical over horizontal progress, is that the veteran has more options about how they go about it. They've unlocked more skills, so can use different movesets, but all the relative power is the same, give or take (it is hard to go exactly the same, of course, but by giving a decent set of starter skills to everyone at character creation, you may never need to unlock another skill if you don't want to. Same with Talents)
its just not enough! they need to play with the horizontal vs vertical slider too, they need to find the balance between achievements to work.
and just rememberת while its cool that a new player can join an old player in game and have fun, and old player need to keep having fun to stay in the game, and this is not what we got nowץ the game is a week barely on, and already most players stop playing, its just not fun.
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I could say that the reason many have stopped playing for now is that a certain other game has been released, which has been registering some very impressive player numbers.
Yes, players want some sort of vertical progression, and that's what talents are for. You need to find the balance on those. Previously they were excessively poweful. Now I feel that they are still a bit too powerful, but others have different opinions, so we are probably near the right compromise.
