Damage bonus: it could be so easy
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- Dexterity gives damage bonus to light melee weapons and ranged weapons
- Strength gives damage bonus to medium melee weapons and heavy melee weapons
- Intelligence gives damage bonus to mage staffs and spells
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@Blectorn Imo STR should affect light melee weapons as well -> irl it does. This way rogues could still neglect STR, but if they wished, they could invest some points into STR to hit harder and get some "raw" survivability as bonus (or go INT way and get magical survivability...the more choices the better
).
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I agree with that idea that str gives bonuses to light melee weapons. Dex could player a better role, but str is also needed to be important for rouges.
I think also that the attributes could provide a separate damage bonus for it is very easy to reach 100% damage bonus cap.
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@MorganReed said in Damage bonus: it could be so easy:
I think also that the attributes could provide a separate damage bonus for it is very easy to reach 100% damage bonus cap.
That would be great.
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@MorganReed that 100% bonus will surely be increased as str 25 (reachable by bearkin and hellfire) will give 110% melee dmg by itself - well hopefully at least for some races
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A mage has as primary attribute intelligence and as secondary attribute perception and constitution.
A warrior has strength as primary attribute and Perception and Constitution as secondary attribute.
A tank has as primary attribute Constitution and as secondary attribute Strength and Dexterity.A rogue has as primary attribute Dexterity and Perception and as secondary attribute Strength and Constitution, because his skills depend very much on Dexterity and Perception:
It makes a difference if you ignore 40% of the armor or 80% and if you have a cooldown of 11 seconds or 6 seconds.
If you want to be a good rogue, you need also intelligence, because the skills are also more expensive than those of a warrior.
In DnD on which Fractured is based on there are light weapons that have the ability finesse. Damage is increased by Dexterity for these weapons. This could fix the problem with the rogues.
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@Blectorn said in Damage bonus: it could be so easy:
In DnD on which Fractured is based on there are light weapons that have the ability finesse. Damage is increased by Dexterity for these weapons. This could fix the problem with the rogues.
We've been considering "Finesse" for a while now, it's definitely something that could be introduced before the start of the Winter Alpha.
@Blectorn the effectiveness of "mage" spells is already based on INT. Sometimes it's the damage that stacks with INT, sometimes it's a different effect (e.g. the duration of a status effect), but they pretty much always do
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@Prometheus pls not! too many stats just creating confusion, simplify!!!
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@Meziljin You sound like a first edition dnd player
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@Farlander just old enough to know that new generation players want easy UI and fast approach to the game basic rules, the old school games are hard to understand and appreciate, reducing appeal, better avoid a niche game...
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@Meziljin Well many nyoung players played Path of Exile and GRIM DAWN as well ---> these games (especially Grim dawn´s system of defence, i mean one can theorycraft hours on one build in Grim dawn, in Fractured making your build takes like 10 minutes) were x-time more complicated than Fractured. Also I haven´t met many "young" guys on this forum, imo 30-35 years is average age of Fractured fan
The game is supersimple atm, making it even simplier would rather hurt it imo.
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@asspirin that's the point, this game is attracting players with average of 30-35, because it feels Ultima Online and old school gameplay. Game is ambitious and need a lot of players to work properly so it's important to avoid a too complex gameplay otherwise population will drop faster than expected.
I'm not against the rules of the old school games, but to be honest this game cannot work only with 30+ aged players
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@Meziljin I agree with your points, but unless game has depth it becomes repetitive and boring soon. GRIM DAWN is still played despite not being mmo because of so many posibilities to build, Id mention DII as well, but thats different story (mainly nostalgy and atmosphere reasons).
Where exactly would You make it simplier?re: "pls not! too many stats just creating confusion, simplify!!!"
---> so far INT is main stat for most schools of magic (assassins, warriors and hunters have str, con, dex + per), each int based school must have various other stats involved as well, or race with high int is a must (just as Abilities for warrior for example have STR increasing potency of ability and CON reducing cooldown). If abilities had three attributes involved game would imo be even better as stats would matter. Oversimplifying the game to level of Albion online (only pick 5 pieces of equipment and increase their level, no further customization) would imo make it mobile game clone.
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@asspirin Well to start we still dunno what exactly do strenght, dexterity, constitution etc
Actually when a player create a character, stats will be fixed and cannot be adjusted in any way, so for example i created a character with a 20 str and 17 dex, but no Per (didn'y know what is supposed to do), so i created character not good as warrior, not as archer or assassin.
Game give no description of what each point give, have to check the wiki but it is not attendable becaouse a lot of things on wiki are not yet implemented (first case a wiki have more information than game self).
A lot of skills require 2 stats and particular armors and weapons, reducing a lot the possible combinations, this is bad because hybrid solution could improve experience and gameplay.
It could be interesting to allow to adjust stats in game by sparring on dummy (craftable in your house), this could give possibility to try different way without compromise the multi-slot for characters (i doubt a player respec stats each tyme he want try tank assassin, mage, tamer etc).
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@Meziljin said in Damage bonus: it could be so easy:
@asspirin Well to start we still dunno what exactly do strenght, dexterity, constitution etc
Actually when a player create a character, stats will be fixed and cannot be adjusted in any way, so for example i created a character with a 20 str and 17 dex, but no Per (didn'y know what is supposed to do), so i created character not good as warrior, not as archer or assassin.
Game give no description of what each point give, have to check the wiki but it is not attendable becaouse a lot of things on wiki are not yet implemented (first case a wiki have more information than game self).I hope for the release what the states do will be mentioned during character creation.
Its fine to get the information in a Wiki for now.
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I would prefer stats to matter less overall.
Right now they matter a lot, in some cases almost breaking the game (check the thread about the high CON effects).
If I make a "warrior" char and want to change playstyle and go hurling around some spell, I can't do it, because I'm seriously bad at it. I should be able to change roles more efficiently. Having one role where you char is best at, is fine. If your char is high on STR and CON, then he will be better as a warrior. You shouldn't suck that much though if you stray from that path.
I envision the difference between someone in his favorite class and someone else, to be around 20% of overall effectiveness (damage/durations/endurance...). Right now it is more similar to 100%, you need 2 players in a secondary class to equal someone in his best class.
Under these terms, you simply don't stray from your main class.
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I personally prefer having only a single "good" class build per character. If someone wants to be able to multi-class they should have major disadvantages for doing so.... such as a bard being a jack of all trades but mediocre at every one of them. Having to have other players in a party to fill roles, improves parties and keeps down game imbalances.
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@Ostaff said in Damage bonus: it could be so easy:
I personally prefer having only a single "good" class build per character. If someone wants to be able to multi-class they should have major disadvantages for doing so.... such as a bard being a jack of all trades but mediocre at every one of them. Having to have other players in a party to fill roles, improves parties and keeps down game imbalances.
Then this whole game system is meaningless.
Everything is built around the concept that you should learn and adapt. Having one "good" class is fine only as long as the "non good" classes are still acceptably good.
Right now it isn't working, the secondary classes are too inefficient compared to the main one.
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Regarding old school games, I remember the first time I sat down to play Baldur's Gate II. I was overwhelmed during character creation by the sheer number of choices for which I had no meaningful information.
For me at least, that requires a test playthrough to find out what I really want, then a restart to spec everything my way. I don't like that.
I'd rather see a few meaningful choices presented over time than a plethora of meaningless choices presented all at once, and if a game has to present choices for which I can't yet make an informed decision, the game allows me to revisit those choices, with a minimum of repetition.
If I were the developer, I'd do the following:
- Make base stats part of the knowledge system, so that players can easily experiment with changing them.
That would tend to increase the number of unique builds and the number of hidden, good builds that players keep to themselves, while removing the pressure for new players to find an existing popular build (since they won't be locked in to any particular build, other than what's appropriate for their selected race).
That would also allow players more flexibility to play the roles needed for their party, which will tend to increase overall party activity on the map (you won't have to be waiting around in town for a healer, for example).
While I'm at it, I'd also remove the intelligence effect on memorization, so you could always select X skills (probably 8).
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You can't make it a fixed number of skills, since some skills are more powerful than others and balanced by the fact that they cost more points.
