Monster infrequent weapons?
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In game we have helmets from monsters (deer, wolf, bear) that offer various kinds of bonus stats. Also necklases offering other bonuses (fox, rabbit, bear, wolf). Are there planned also weapons from monsters? In GRIM DAWN enemies could drop item specific for them - these items are called Monster infrequents (MI) - armour, weapons and jewelery offering unique bonuses not only to stats, but also skills.
I was thinking something like if you kill spider, weapon made of it´s teeth migh add poison damage, offhand made of lich head might reduce enemy defence agains magic damage etc. Talking about skills, are there any "skillers" planned to further specialise your toon (in case i wanted to be illusionist, is there any way, aside of increasing charisma, to make illusion skills stronger) ?
To helmets / pendants from monsters - will there be tiers just as with weapons (primitive --> metal)?
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There could be something... if not a complete weapon then materials for it.
For example, you need "parts" of poisonous animal, to create a weapon that does poison damage. You can't create such weapon purely from mats gathered from wolves and bears.
Venom sac from spiders, could be needed to add poison properties to a blade, for which you also need iron / steel, which you need to mine.
Players can't from a poisonous blade purely from spider parts.
Without steel and other materials.
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From what I understand, you don't get full drops from mobs and if you do it's very rare. However, each mob has a list of possible drops, among which, as @Gothix said, there's a bunch of materials. So, you need to kill a certain kind of mob to craft a specific weapon.
PS: if they want to implement full drops from mobs and keep the item generation crafting-only, they could make something similar to Albion's black market: players sell items to the a NPC (the black market) and when you kill a npc and are supposed to get a full drop you get one from black market's inventory (it is a bit more complex, but I explained the general idea).
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@Razvan said in Monster infrequent weapons?:
From what I understand, you don't get full drops from mobs and if you do it's very rare. However, each mob has a list of possible drops, among which, as @Gothix said, there's a bunch of materials. So, you need to kill a certain kind of mob to craft a specific weapon.
PS: if they want to implement full drops from mobs and keep the item generation crafting-only, they could make something similar to Albion's black market: players sell items to the a NPC (the black market) and when you kill a npc and are supposed to get a full drop you get one from black market's inventory (it is a bit more complex, but I explained the general idea).
I think humanoid monsters should drop weapons such as gnolls and goblins and bandits, but wolfs and other monsters who dont use weapons should not, maybe we could use monster teeth as arrow heads and bones as spears or swords but we should need to craft them
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I will still argue that hunting will get boring if all you get as drops are mats. Loot drops are what make killing mobs fun for me. If people want to rationalize where the loot comes from many monsters have lairs. This can be the lair loot.
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@Farlander Gathering and crafting will be a lot less relevant if mobs drop full items.
From my opinion, the gatherers should be the ones who produce all the resources needed to craft a base item. It's a lot of money, but it's also risky because you gather out there in the wild. Then, people who farm in dungeons get artifacts as drops with which you can upgrade or mod a base item. I don't know how will crafting/refining work to make it worth having a dedicated character for these tasks. Anyway, the thing is that this way they stimulate the economy (since everything has to be crafted by someone and items will eventually be destroyed by losing durability) and you give different kind of players* their fun.*the gatherer that likes to gather static nodes of resources and evade gankers, the gatherer that likes to solo and skin animals for leather or gargoyles for stone, the people who like to do dungeons in a party
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@Farlander said in Monster infrequent weapons?:
I will still argue that hunting will get boring if all you get as drops are mats. Loot drops are what make killing mobs fun for me. If people want to rationalize where the loot comes from many monsters have lairs. This can be the lair loot.
but a rat shouldn't drop a full plate set, 2h bastard sword, etc. i dont want to see the game changed from materials to every grub worm dropping weapons.
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I'm not sure how they put together their item database but this could be as easy as defining items to sizes, and thus loot tables picking from those sizes as well as percentages. I, personally, prefer that mostly components drop and some mobs dropping other things. Being able to deconstruct items (including drops if the do full item drop) into components is also something i'd highly suggest.
The design should push to keep crafters relevant, and within the item cycle.
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There is no way a rabbit should drop a 2h axe... where from?
But i could easily see wolf drop a ring that he swallowed while eating someones hand.There can be item loot inside mobs and it can be realistic in same time.
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@Gothix said in Monster infrequent weapons?:
There is no way a rabbit should drop a 2h axe... where from?
But i could easily see wolf drop a ring that he swallowed while eating someones hand.There can be item loot inside mobs and it can be realistic in same time.
Yeah but not a entire sword, unless the wolf is massive maybe it would be a enraged greater wolf? When you kill it and chop it up you find why its enraged ( bellyache)
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@Xzoviac Grim Dawn MI system is imo perfect; btw
For example, you need "parts" of poisonous animal, to create a weapon that does poison damage. You can't create such weapon purely from mats gathered from wolves and bears.
thats how Grim dawn does it - shield from scarap carapace, mandible from giant spider as dagger, huge petrified hand used as hammer - all these must get handles to be usable etc. Or weapon/armour drops streight away it its humanoid foe (who uses weapon).
Ofc nonlogical drops make no sense.
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You guys crack me up when you want realistic explanations for a fantasy game in which most of it is not real lol. A game needs to be enjoyable not explainable. For me hunting will be rather boring if all you get in loot drops are mats. I highly doubt rare mats will be dropping from bunnies. To that regard there will never be a reason to kill one or any other creature that will not drop the rare mats. Basic mats will be dropping on everything which means the supply will heavily outweigh the demand.
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@Farlander said in Monster infrequent weapons?:
You guys crack me up when you want realistic explanations for a fantasy game in which most of it is not real lol. A game needs to be enjoyable not explainable. For me hunting will be rather boring if all you get in loot drops are mats. I highly doubt rare mats will be dropping from bunnies. To that regard there will never be a reason to kill one or any other creature that will not drop the rare mats. Basic mats will be dropping on everything which means the supply will heavily outweigh the demand.
The fact remains that DS wants realistic drops
They have said this from the startAll the best stories, games comics, dungeons and dragons have rules based on reality
Reality can be bent using magic/science/gods
But even these will have rules.As soon as everything is possible because "magic" actions and reactions have less meaning
Understanding DS's aim and vision, it's best to make suggestions that coinside with that perspective unless ofc you dont like it.
However its unlikely DS will change its vision based on one person.
So if you want to influence the progression of the game in anyway, the likely course of action is to make suggestions that agree with DS's ultimate goal.
I personally dont mind if rabbits explode with loot.
The reason my above statements want items to drop based in reality is because that's what DS wants.
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@Farlander said in Monster infrequent weapons?:
You guys crack me up when you want realistic explanations for a fantasy game in which most of it is not real lol. A game needs to be enjoyable not explainable. For me hunting will be rather boring if all you get in loot drops are mats. I highly doubt rare mats will be dropping from bunnies. To that regard there will never be a reason to kill one or any other creature that will not drop the rare mats. Basic mats will be dropping on everything which means the supply will heavily outweigh the demand.
rabbit meat will be, i'm guess here, easier to obtain than other.
i didnt back a loot pinata game, D3 and PoE already exist. There's pvp to keep the game interesting, if you're playing on the fury planet then you'll probably get bored.
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I agree, in a sandbox game gear shouldn't be obtained with killing monsters, it should be only craftable.
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I'm with @Gothix et al who see mats coming from most mob kills but not top-tier weapons.
What would make sense to me is if fighting npcs like goblins & shamans dropped their weapons once defeated, but those weapons would either be low-level or base weapons (upgradable but not much better than what anyone could make themselves).
A high-level npc boss on Beastworld might drop something more desirable... there might even be a quest involved in attaining such a drop... but if the boss is that strong, it would take a team to bring them down. Then the Mighty Staff of Whatzisbucket would be a prize worth dueling for.... on another planet....
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@Shivashanti said in Monster infrequent weapons?:
I agree, in a sandbox game gear shouldn't be obtained with killing monsters, it should be only craftable.
Eve is a sandbox but it has loot drops too.
if anything i think the normal worlds would have very little loot drops but the asteroids could have them.
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@Farlander said in Monster infrequent weapons?:
You guys crack me up when you want realistic explanations for a fantasy game in which most of it is not real lol. A game needs to be enjoyable not explainable. For me hunting will be rather boring if all you get in loot drops are mats. I highly doubt rare mats will be dropping from bunnies. To that regard there will never be a reason to kill one or any other creature that will not drop the rare mats. Basic mats will be dropping on everything which means the supply will heavily outweigh the demand.
The fairly inexpensive gear crafted only from base mats will be used (and destroyed) a lot in zvz. Besides, there could be a big variety of base mats dropping from different mobs. This should keep the economy running on demon and human planet. I don't understand how the economy will work on furries planet tho.
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I really like the way DS is handling loot.
Crafting stays useful, in most games I played crafting armour and weapons was not, because BiS came from Dungeons/Raids/PvP rewards.
And yes, this is a fantasy game, but it adds some flavour that the drops are more realistic. Gnolls and other humanoids will get hunted for gold......and my precious !!
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@Farlander for me explainable IS enjoyable.
I really dislike non-logical things.
To specify... what doesnt exist (magic) isnt illogical, it can still be explained by metaphisics etc. Even in other logical ways. If you take damage by fireball you will get burned. That is all logic. Even if we dont see fireballs in real life.
If you watch star trek it all has sci fi logic involved even if we dont have starships yet.But rabbit carrying 2h axe inside is just lame. And completely UNenjoyable.
