Will zergs rule the open world?
-
Have there been any discussions, that what kind of role or influence zergs will have in Fractured?
I am personally huge fan of open world PvP group fights, but still more like small or medium scale than large zerg fights. Okay I admit, that sometimes massive ZvZ battles can be epic, but not something I like to see all the time.
So I was wondering, that will Fractured also support small scale PvP or will zergs rule the lands? So are we going to see some kind of anti-zerging mechanics or not? And if we are, what kind of and how those will be implemented?
We could speculate, that in Syndesia there could be some restrictions, but what about Tartaros, totally free PvP?
-
there should be a post on this. just use that search box.
-
@Jetah Well where we need new post if we should always search the old ones? If you want to go that road, then you can answer that same line to almost every new post for upcoming few years, and end every conversation before those even started. Moreover, these forums seams to be quite quiet so it does not matter much if some topics are discussed several times. In most cases those conversations have own flavor, direction and contain new point of views. Also when game advances it unlocks new information related to old aspects of game and only that will make same old topics somehow different.
-
At some point, a zerg will hopefully do more damage to their comrades than the opponent
-
@Pluto Hmmm.. So you referred to friendly fire? I think I saw somewhere, that this feature exists in Fractured. That is one way to prevent zerging for sure and can lead battles to quite messy and chaotic. Friendly fire is interesting and nice feature, but also causes some problems.
There is of course different kind of options prevent zerging, if zerging is wanted to prevent at first place. I presume this would be the case in Syndesia where is some law to protect players in open world, but Tartaros can easily be area where is not suppossed to be any kind of anti-zerging mechanics. I kind of understand that, but its still something which can hurt solo or small scale PvP in Tartaros. However, maybe there is not just one best solution and this matter needs to be compromised somehow. Next I will intoroduce some ideas and options how anti-zerging can be prevented.
-
Zergs could be shown on minimap as dots to players who are at same area/zone.
-
There could simply be pop up warning text or sign when zerg approaches.
-
Players could loose more reputation/karma points when they outnumbers their enemies. Scaling like in situation 3v1 all three gets more penalty than in 1v1 situation. This also gets worse if you e.g. 10v1 someone. This could also work other way so if you win from underdog situation (e.g. 3v5) you get less loss. I could see this as option in Syndesia, but maybe not in Tartaros where is lo law to protect players.
-
This last one is my personal favorite, because I was trying to think it from Fractured point of view. Because we have this perception attribute, maybe that would somehow help us to notice zergs from distance? Maybe you could actually hear (like in real life) when zerg is approaching. How far? Depending size of zerg and your perception level. Moreover, there is also skills under perception so maybe you could unlock some anti-zerging abilities from there? I think that would be really nice.
-
-
@Tuoni I like all your ideas, except the third option (penalizing players for outnumbering their opponents). My reason is simple, I believe whenever you can avoid penalizing players to dissuade them from using certain strategies, you should. Plus there are plenty of other ways to make zerging not so advantageous. I especially like your personal favorite, which I think could work along with your first and second options.
-
@Crowdac I guess you are right. Lets say that third option could be relevant if other anti-zerging mechanics are not helping enough prevent zergs to dominate the lands of Syndesia.
-
@Crowdac That type of idea could function in specific situations maybe?
Betting there could be some reason for it to exist in certain guild vs guild encounters or something like that. If only to simply encourage fighting "fair". When one side becomes too badly outnumbered in games that have those kinda features it quickly shifts from fun to... awful. So a mean of mitigating that could be possibly good.
Anyway, the other ideas are definitely better. That one is certainly iffy, but I mean could be neat too? Dunno. Like the rest without a doubt.
Wonder what they've already got in store to address these types of situations?
-
@Genobee With that suggestion of scaling karma point loss I aimed for "fair" PvP or at least to promote this. It is of course a different thing if this "fair" PvP is wanted to happen at first place. But yeah, I am not sure if this kind of feature could cause some problems or if it can be abused somehow. Also that karma point differency does not need to be huge and slight differencies would most certainly be enough. Anyhow, I am also interested to know what is devs intrests related for zerging and anti-zerging mechanics, and what they have already in their mind.
-
Best option in my view would be to introduce a counter-play mechanic that would give a prepared and organized group of players a way to counter and neutralize a zerg ball.
For example: Have a kind of siege weapon that is focused on anti-infantry. It damages and microstuns in a large AoE, but the damage and length of stun scales with the number of enemies it hits. More enemies = scaling damage. So it's useful against zergs, less useful against smaller squads.
Then you set up a killbox, lure in the zerg, and then bam. Dead zerg.
Just once concept - I'm no game designer and this is just the first thing that came off the top of my head. There's probably better ideas for zerg counterplay than this that a real game designer could come up with.
-
@KairosVal Biggest problem with roaming zergs are that those overruns everything that crosses them. That includes gatherers, explorers, dungeon&raid runners and solo/small scale PvP players. So basically all activity except other zergs. Your siege weapon suggestion was interesting and maybe we can see those in siege battles, but I dont see those help with zerg problem.
-
True, but the same idea can be used for non siege weaponry. We have received hints that there will be traps we can deploy, what with shadow demons having an affinity for traps. There could be traps that are well-tuned for clearing out hordes of players, but be near worthless against a single player. I'm not exactly sure what that would look like... but it's an idea to keep bouncing around in the devs minds during future balancing.
-
@Tuoni
when you've been here long enough, you see the same questions being constantly asked. it's better to point them to the search bar.
-
@Jetah said in Will zergs rule the open world?:
@Tuoni
when you've been here long enough, you see the same questions being constantly asked. it's better to point them to the search bar.It should not go that way. Even I have not been here for long, I have been part of other gaming communities for long time. In those these same topics were discusses much more what here is done. It was never a problem. Now if you do not personally want to discuss that same topic anymore, you could just leave it be and let others discuss who are interested. It is so simple. If there has been good and informative topic before, then you can post that link and not just say use the search bar.. On top of that, the search gives you lots of conversations and reading all those through is something not many people are interested to do. Also necroing old post is kind of argued matter and most cases (what i have seen) those are recommend to just leave be. Moreover, new members comes in forum everyday and they do not care if some people are discussed before of the same topics they are interested atm. It sounds more like those who were here first are privleged to discuss about the hot topics and after that those cases are closed.
To summarize this; Atm you are not helping. You actually help more if you just do not answer, rather than you tell this topic has discussed before and go use search bar for old posts.
-
My Guild On DDO... "Zergers" haha
We had delera's tomb down to 8 minutes. The ruins of Threnal down to 7 minutes.
We were able to do Redwillow Ruins in 4 minutes.
Many of these quests were minimum 30 minutes each but we were dual weilding vorpal swords
and disruptors and greater banes back in the day when level cap was lvl 10.It was great fun.. we'd run to the dungeon.. compete who could get there first.. who could get to the end first without of course dying and beat the boss. We had many weapon sets for each set of mobs with dedicated damage towards that type. I must have had 50 hot bars on my screen that I would rapidly click through as I was running Hasted on my bard.
Yes.. Zergs do happen.. and it can be great fun... but I think the greater message is to have Love for the Game.
-
@Pluto said in Will zergs rule the open world?:
True, but the same idea can be used for non siege weaponry. We have received hints that there will be traps we can deploy, what with shadow demons having an affinity for traps. There could be traps that are well-tuned for clearing out hordes of players, but be near worthless against a single player. I'm not exactly sure what that would look like... but it's an idea to keep bouncing around in the devs minds during future balancing.
Interesting idea, but I can see straight away balance problems and ways to take advantage of another zerg group without much effort or actually fight them. Of course its hard to say at this point what devs exactly have in their minds.
Zergs will be a problem at point where large guilds and alliances dominates all the lands without leaving any playing possibilities to smaller ones. This is ofc a challenge for devs and how they want this to be handled. I just cant see that some kind of traps would be the solution in practise.
-
I actually kind of disagree. If you’re engaging a Zerg with a Zerg, you’ll be in the same area as them. If you use one of those traps, you’re going to damage yourselves as well.
Now, can one Zerg lay a trap for the other? Of course, but so can the other Zerg. I think it can be balanced well. Would be hard to implement overall though.
Unfortunately zergs are an unfortunate reality in games like fractured. Even if anti-Zerg mechanics are implemented, they will find a way to thrive. There just has to be enough countermeasures to make it possible to be outside of a Zerg
-
@Pluto On your idea of traps. The dev's could create a trap that scales damage based on how many enemies are in the AOE. I'm actually fairly certain abilities that operate on this mechanic will exist if they don't already. I only say that because I've seen it in many other games. The only problem with this idea, is during open field battles and sieges these traps might be OP. They would need a pretty lengthy cooldown.
-
@Tuoni
do you know it's possible to read old content and not respond to it.
-
@Jetah I know its possible, but I already gave few examples why most people wont do that. ^^ And what it comes to this specific thread.. I wanted to start a new one and not try to find something possibly similar.
