Most of the newer changes kind of just suck.
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I pretty much agree with the post, especially the loot has to change again. There is not even PvP as a neutral player right now because you gain nothing out of it. I even wonder if the old militias (which aren't a thing anymore?) would change something about that, but atm there is literally no point in PvP'ing as neutral or red beside maybe legends.
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@diabalo12 If you go evil you can pvp anyone anytime if they are not flagged they will get it flipped (may need more testing to verify but it appears that is how it worked when I and a guildie were testing it on alts) If you don't like the loot system for evil just accept that you can't attack good alignment go neutral and pvp other neutrals then everyone is on equal footing
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I like the game as it is now - I don't like PvP - so I'm going for the PVE-world as soon as it is available.
Anyway, this is a VERY EARLY Beta. People, please relax and enjoy exploring and testing and let the Devs do their work. There is still enough to do for the basics of the game. And to lose loot is actually not my most favourite topic, because of MANY other basic things, that need to be fixed first.
Again: It is a BETA and all our data will be destroyed then and when. It's just for testing.
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@GamerSeuss
This game was advertised as full loot. They just did a complete 180 on that, enjoy your sub-par New World 2.0 with less content and worse graphics bro.
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@WaterMerchant Full Loot is only on Tartarus, it specifically didn't give the details of how PvP would work on Syndesia, because they hadn't determined that yet, only that it would be a mix of PvP and PvE
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I feel like there's just a disconnect in expectations here. You have people like the Bussy memebers in this thread who want a full loot PvP experience. They want to be able to roll up on anyone, kill them, get their gear, and be on equal footing in terms of reward/risk. Where you can log in every day, go red bandit, and just roam around killing people if you choose, zone control if you choose, etc.
But based on everything I've seen the developers say, news articles they released, videos, and what it says on their website; this is not supposed to be the sole focus of the game. They do not want you, on the neutral planet, spending most of your time roaming around red. Going red on Syndesia is something you build up to, do it for a little bit, then tag down. The more you go red, the greater risk you incur. You get the advantage of being able to kill anyone you want and choosing your battles. If you're trying to PvE, Farm, and regularly play on Syndesia while staying red 24/7, you're doing it wrong. That's not what the planet is made for.
That is what the demon planet is going to be for. Where you can go and just run around killing everything with a pulse. Where you'll be able to invade Syndesia and kill players.
So if you ask me, the current system is working as intended. The fact you feel so punished for going bandit means its doing its job. The fact that most PvP is going to take place between neutrals over legend summons and city related fighting sounds like its working as intended. But most importantly, as its been said in this thread, we should not be throwing our weight one way or another until we see how things will behave with a demon planet. If demon planet releases and nobody plays demon, then that should be more than enough to tell you what the majority of the players think about that gameplays style.
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@GamerSeuss
"Full loot is only on Tartarus" until the carebears decide demons are really cool and complain they can't play as one without being "harassed" by pvpers. The game went from full loot to partial loot and now "full loot if you're a masochist who wants all risk and no reward". The game gave the impression that it would be full loot from the start and now pulled a new world, this game is not for me, I'm fine with that but it kinda sucks I lost 40 bucks. Enjoy New World 2.0 bro :).
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@WaterMerchant i do not know where you got the idea this is a pvp full loot game? there would be a pvp full loot planet, but not the all game... and im in this game from the start....
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I am not personally a fan of recipes dropping from mobs and I think those should be unlocked via town tech, crafting and perhaps even gathering. It would make more sense to need develop town, research resources and progress in crafting to open new recipes, and perhaps implement a system which combines all these aspects.
About the PvE - PvP discussion, I bet that what we are testing atm will not be the final form because two planets are still missing and now everyone, regardless of their playstyle, needs to live in the same world. Therefore, the rules needs to be approriate for the situation.
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@WaterMerchant Actually the game went from testing full loot to where it is now, however, from the very beginning of the game, it was stated that only Tartarus was going to be the Full Loot, PvP planet. It wasn't sprung on you. It wasn't a bait and switch, they were clear from the beginning that Syndesia would not be a PvP focused world, and that they would experiment with ways to balance out the world of Syndesia to meet the expectations of the game. Syndesia, as others have said, is working pretty much exactly as it is meant to right now, PvP-wise. It is an available, but heavily discouraged option. Tartarus will always be a full loot PvP planet, because that is also the exact plan from the beginning. The only way Tartarus won't be kept PvP heavy is if nobody signs up to play it PvP, not just because so-called "carebear" players argue it into PvE over PvP. Yes, people might want to play the other races, BUT that is not how FO is designed or intended, and the Devs have been pretty adamant that they won't be changing their core values and goals for anyone.
The game 'impression' you speak of was never given by Dynamight Studios, it was made clear from the very beginning that it would NOT be that way, in fact. If you misinterpreted what they were selling, that is on you, as they were 100% clear, and this is coming from someone who has been backing this game from the very beginning.
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I agree with much of this post.
Theres just no way in any situation where one player drops full loot and another doesnt is fair or right.
This has to be changed.
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There are a lot of things that either won't work, or we won't know how they'll work until all the pieces are put together; alignment, the criminal system, PVP, all that sort of thing is to a large extent guesswork at the moment, but at least they are getting some feedback as to what works/doesn't, how and why so that when it is all together they wont need to fiddle around as much.
As to crafting, I personally am a big fan of the smelting system, it really gives the feel that you are working towards something and achieving something, but yes the non-metal crafting has a serious advantage, which would make sense if metal was just better, but given the balancing (successful or otherwise) for various playstyles they should also balance the crafting required for those playstyles. I have made some suggestions to this effect elsewhere; Hides counting as heavy materials like metals do (they should bring back ingots as heavy materials in my opinion) but I don't know what you could do for cloth; perhaps you have to bring a larger part of the creature to be refined; for mammoths maybe the hide (is there mammoth leather? haven't checked yet) could be refined (only at a workstation) into the hair and the hide/leather. maybe the spiders 'web-gland' (abdomen?) as a heavy material that is refined into silk? and so on.
I definitely think that all cloth should only be craftable at workstation; perhaps some people are able to weave linen by hand in the wild, but personally I cant
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P.S. By "all the pieces" I mean, all the worlds, races etc. In case that was unclear
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@diabalo12 said in Most of the newer changes kind of just suck.:
@Radamand It already does suck being red they get caught and go to jail for 2 days, they shouldn't also lose their gear if no one else does. It's simply an inequivalent risk reward and completely destroys the red playstyle.
Considering the 'red playstyle' is to murder and harass innocents, I don't mind them being at a huge disadvantage. There should never be a 'reward' for PKing, period.
FYI- I used to run a huge red guild in Ultima Online.
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We don't care about your guild in Ultima.
Imo if the game is supposed to somewhat real-like or realistic gear being stuck to a peasants body with super-ultra-glue is a bit silly.Why do you think PKing should not be beneficial?
Imagine 5000 players on the map fighting for resource, but not really fighting more like camping by depleted resources waiting for the mto spawn, because there's too many people and there is no competition for them as no one wants to PK due to jail.The game would be BorInG
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Reds on Syndesia are at a disadvantage. That's by design.
We can discuss exactly on the correct amount of disadvantage, but don't expect a fair fight.
For example, the previous system had a partial drop for blue, a bit more drop for neutral and full drop for Red, and most were fine with it.
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@spoletta Well to be fair I'm pretty much just asking for the partial drops to come back or reds to not drop gear either. Even if reds didn't drop gear they would still be at a massive disadvantage and even if it was partial loot they would still be losing everything. If your going to have it so no one can gain gear from PvP but blues that just lets blues snowball whereas reds have to constantly grind to be geared and instead will use naked mage builds.
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Basically since it's come to this point and clearly no one wants to drop gear in a game where it takes 20 hours for a kit, maybe no one should drop gear, not reds not blues not neutrals. just make it a fucking inventory loot system and call it a day, but don't completely ruin the risk reward for red players and call that balanced.
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I disagree, equip loot should come back in some form.
