Give us Attribute Resets please
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Our actions should have consequences. Play what you roll. Make thoughtful decisions. If your PC is just too broken, or not to your liking then start again. Or find a way in game (gear skills knowledge whatever) to tweak your PC to help smooth out initial build deficiencies.
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What if to even be able to change certain point you would first need to find knowledge that lets you know how to do that in the first place.
Knowledge for learning charisma, knowledge for unlearning charisma,.... all knowledge for all types of points would be extremely hard to find... and even when found, changing would still have cooldown.
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I like how SWTOR added legacy stuff into the game. All your characters on your account were part of the same legacy family tree. It would be nice if the characters on your account shared the knowledge unlocks for all characters made on the account. That way you wouldn't have to explore all over again just to unlock perks for new characters you make.
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@Logain said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
Because it changes everything in your experience.
Have you ever tried to join a poker tournament, then tried to argue that you should be allowed to join in again if you lost your money, because it doesn't change anything for the other players? Have you argued with open world free for all PvPers that PvPn should be consensual only, because it changes nothing for their experience?i'm sorry mate but I don't see how any of the examples you gave are comparable to what we are discussing... How exacly having completely free unlimited atribute reset hurt your gameplay style of restarting from scratch? would It give other players who just enjoy the freedom an edge over you? how exaclty would that negatilvely affect your experience of the game???
because I told you if I have to go through all of the laboureus steps of bulding a char just to tune or shift my atributes i'd be pissed, frustrated and possibly could quit the game before doing so (maybe not but you get the point) I'm pretty certain i'm not alone in this.
Make it a quest, a fine, whatever but give the player freedom to tune, shift or experiment how the variations in atributes affect his performance withoud having bad consequences to it!!
@Gothix said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
Attribute change being "possible" doesn't mean it has to be "free".
It can be possible to change attributes, but it can be BOTH limited by long cool down, and super expensive, so it will also require considerable effort on your part to be able to do it.
@Jetah said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
it can cost 10k gold, 1000 of every resource to redo 1 point per month/quarter/bi-year/year.
@Gibbx said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
Our actions should have consequences. Play what you roll. Make thoughtful decisions. If your PC is just too broken, or not to your liking then start again.
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You don't even know what you have to do for the talent tree, the schools of magic or even upgrade your skills, so this discussion is totally unnecessary atm because you probably want a twink anyway if you want to change your playstyle drasticly.
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@Logain said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
@Jetah said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
(...)I'm in the expensive and over time group myself(...)
I think I'm in that group as well
That said, how would you handle 'races'? Since people here seem to despite the consequences of the initial choice on attributes for their gameplay, it would appear that shouldn't be much different for their choice of race (since it has an equal effect on attributes and hence gameplay)?i hate making those choices without even playing the game a little. we should have the option to get in game, try out a few archetypes then place our points.
i know people want consequences but people will leave the game or will look for meta builds. telling a person they wasted 6 months on their character because 2 points of x stat was placed wrong isn't something that'll keep a healthy population.@Gibbx
there will be plenty of losses in the game already. having a minor stat change wont kill off the game.@Gothix
i like that, maybe add that with a sacrifice of something.@PedroBillyMattos
because stat change shouldn't be unlimited, it shouldn't be quick and it shouldn't be free.
if you're weak and want to get strong, it takes times. if you're dumb and you want to be smart. you're probably sol but you can read, find mentors, find great teachers. if you want to be great at parkour you start slow then work yourself up. all of these take time, energy and aren't 'free' (i mean they all cost time).
i dont mind a small percent of knowledge gained from characters be shared. IE you get 100 knowledge on a main, 10 is shared to the account.
realistically we could have knowledge for this. you'd have to unlock it for every character to share what they've learned and will learn. it'd make alts useful too!
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@PedroBillyMattos said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
(...)would It give other players who just enjoy the freedom an edge over you? how exaclty would that negatilvely affect your experience of the game?(...)
In a competitive environment, optional choice can become mandatory through the generated benefits. This is the case here as well, if you can change attributes, you have to do so, since people who don't are at a severe disadvantage in a player versus player situation.
@Jetah said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
(...)try out a few archetypes then place our points(...)
Archetypes as in 'races', or as in 'builds' (such as tank, raged,...)?
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I still feel that the current more "hard Core" route is best.
If additional attributes are added through training say +1 Str through unarmed combat that is different.
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@Logain said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
@PedroBillyMattos said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
(...)would It give other players who just enjoy the freedom an edge over you? how exaclty would that negatilvely affect your experience of the game?(...)
In a competitive environment, optional choice can become mandatory through the generated benefits. This is the case here as well, if you can change attributes, you have to do so, since people who don't are at a severe disadvantage in a player versus player situation.
@Jetah said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
(...)try out a few archetypes then place our points(...)
Archetypes as in 'races', or as in 'builds' (such as tank, raged,...)?
How is one able to 'reset' their race?
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@Jetah said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
(...)How is one able to 'reset' their race?
That's kind of exactly the problem I intended to highlight and discuss.
But even if you are play-testing 'archetypes', you'd have to have a 'race'. How would you handle that during your suggested initial testing?
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Isn't this also about people who just play games for a few months/weeks and don't want all the hassle and people who are in a game for the long run and have no problem remaking characters over the years?
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@Yitra said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
Isn't this also about people who just play games for a few months/weeks and don't want all the hassle and people who are in a game for the long run and have no problem remaking characters over the years?
I agree, this is also about the willingness to invest "time" developing the Characters. Not so much about the transcendent Meta toon from start i could see having Stat resets in games where you are limited to 1 toon.
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@Logain said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
@Jetah said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
(...)How is one able to 'reset' their race?
That's kind of exactly the problem I intended to highlight and discuss.
But even if you are play-testing 'archetypes', you'd have to have a 'race'. How would you handle that during your suggested initial testing?there really is no discussion on race here. you create one for each or you stick with one or you create a few. we're talking about attributes though. unless DS gives us paid race change you're stuck with it.
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@Jetah said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
there really is no discussion on race here. you create one for each or you stick with one or you create a few. we're talking about attributes though. unless DS gives us paid race change you're stuck with it.
Sure you do, as Demons and Beastling can be limited in their meta build with the different caps within the (sub) race
So if people don't want to rebuild characters, they also need to give the option to change your (sub) race.
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@Yitra said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
@Jetah said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
there really is no discussion on race here. you create one for each or you stick with one or you create a few(...)
So if people don't want to rebuild characters, they also need to give the option to change your (sub) race.
points up
Race has as high an influence on attributes as 'redistributing' does. So, if people argue that they don't want to create three different characters to end up with an attribute distribution they like, the same would be valid for 'race' as well. BUT with the difference that races are very intervened with the gameplay experience you are looking for (Beastman play a lot different from Demon by design), hence you can not just 'exchange them' without severely redesigning the game as such (including the exploration aspect of knowledge).
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I fully expect to create my maximum characters it would just be nice if the knowledge tree would be across the account. I realize that circumvents the idea that good characters will have to traverse the evil lands and vice versa. I just don't want to have to spend the time exploring on every character to get my knowledge points. It will end up being a grind that I do believe I'm not going to enjoy. Much like finding holocrons on on my characters in SWTOR.
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@Yitra
race change has never been free.this post is about attribute resets. obviously, which seems to be going over your head, that we could change the attributes within the race selected!
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@Jetah said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
@Yitra
race change has never been free.Who is talking about a free change?
this post is about attribute resets. obviously, which seems to be going over your head, that we could change the attributes within the race selected!
If I had created a Blood Demon with the intentions of going the caster way (with a +3 max cap on INT) and after a while I would rather go for a melee build (which a Hellfire Demon is far more suited for with a +3 cap in STR and CON) just an attribute reset would be nice, but for PvP it would still be sub-optimal and no PvP-er in its right mind would not rebuild then. Same goes for Beastmen, although it will feel less painful if they avoid PvP, then again, it would be a sub-par build.
So just an attribute change is nice for the occasional mistake at the start, but for a real change of playstyle, you need a change of sub-race as well (or rebuild what people try to avoid apparently).
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people will like the aesthetics of certain sub-race but the play style may change. changing the attributes allows for the person to keep the aesthetics they want and get a playstyle they want.
again, i'm not even sure where you brought up race as the discussion isn't about that.
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@Jetah said in Give us Attribute Resets please:
(...)people will like the aesthetics of certain sub-race but the play style may change. changing the attributes allows for the person to keep the aesthetics they want and get a playstyle they want.
again, i'm not even sure where you brought up race as the discussion isn't about that.
Because, as @Yitra and I pointed out, race has far more impact in Fractured than 'aesthetics'? Different race comes with different attributes. The whole point and argumentation in this thread is that people can't be bothered to create more than one character and should be allowed to change their attributes to always have the perfect attribute distribution for the build they want to play with currently. Now, if you are stuck with your race, even if you would be allowed to redistribute your attributes and you could not change your race as well, you'd still be in the same 'bad' position you are now and would have to create a new character, since you still wouldn't have achieved the goal you wanted, to have the best possible attribute distribution for a new build.
