Posts made by Whisper

I planted a few clover plots but when it came time to harvest them nothing happened. The soil nutrition didn't change, and I wasn't able to harvest anything.

https://discord.gg/c27BrRshjr

I tried to place a chest inside my house and realized I cannot. It's just red. Unless outside then it is blue.

If I try to build a fireplace I get a message saying, "You must be inside a building you own to build this".

I took a screenshot to show the red chest and saw my neighbor's plot and remembered. His plot is currently broken. If you look at it, it is just the floor and walls which he has built. But the next stage never turned blue for him so he is stuck. Other then this though I have been having a blast!

@Farlander said in Death and what it entails:

So we don't have any dev info yet on this subject? We can all speculate and discuss the subject but I'd rather know where the jump off point is. I think up to this point I have only heard there will be damage upon death. I haven't seen anything about being knocked out causing damage. If it only happens at death and death is not often in PvE then this isn't a big deal. However, if we die often each session this could be a big deal if damage is high and you have to constantly repair/replace your gear.

I'll test this during the next Alpha test. I will say I died to teleport home a lot in the last alpha and played all day. And my gear didn't start needing to be replaced by the end of the 2nd day.

So if we currently lose durability on death or knockdown neither are in a position that really handicaps people's play time. The amount of times I died almost makes me feel like it could be tuned up on death. But it is at an okay spot.

My hope is that the game's economy works into this and people who enjoy farming can trade food for gear from other players/governors, and people who enjoy PVEing can trade regents for gear. People who enjoy crafting can trade gear for the other items. And people who enjoy PVPing can just loot it from people.

You got plenty of time to get a founder's pack If anyone else is interested in joining I recommend you jump in on Discord.

The guild often hits up random games while we wait for Fractured

@Jetah said in Your favorite Dailies, or what you would like to see them as.:

@Whisper

no game should encourage daily log ins. playing the game should be optional, not a requirement.

daily quest:
child: mom i'm bored
Mom: go brush your teeth
child: still bored
Mom: clean your room

those are quest. you ask for something to do and it's given to you.

Daily content
you, brush your teeth, clean your room, do w/e part of dishes, mop, dust, etc.

You dont have to ask for those as it's just something you do.

Both examples given the content is optional and not required. Think someone hit it on the head earlier saying it is a psychological issue.

@Manaia said in Skills gained through different means:

Getting non-combat skills would be fun.
I wouldn't expect any combat skills to be gotten by gathering/processing/profession stuff, but definitely should be rewarded for doing more of it. Right now they exist as knowledge but it's a one-shot thing - it's either you have it or you don't, there's no knowledge grind for these things, just a checklist if you have it or not.

I like this idea. Would add a whole new dynamic to being a crafter/gather focused player. I feel like gathering regents used for poisoning could offer poison based skills/buffs (Maybe just increasing their usage duration or amount created when crafting poisons), etc.

Not sure if we are passed the point where they could add something like this but it is a great idea.

@Manaia said in What kind of game do you hope Fractured will be?:

@Tuoni I did think about having a third option for them being equal. I'm not sure if I didn't specify the question good enough or if people are reading too quickly (not a jab) and not fully comprehending it. The game obviously is going to be both an RPG and sandbox, but if it was a slider, which point would they gravitate to more. That's eventually why I ended up with having only the two options. Having an "equal" option would basically be the same as "I don't care" in my mind.

I think I don't care would be a 4th option. Leaning toward either choice is a choice. Wanting there to be a mixture is a choice as well. Not caring would be a different choice entirely.

Someone who wants a mixture wants a mixture. If the table started tilting too much to one side where the other disappears then they would get upset because they care very much. As someone who picked the first choice I would have preferred a mix of both option because I would not want to see the sandbox genre removed from the game by any means.

@Gothix said in Your favorite Dailies, or what you would like to see them as.:

Ah I would also like to connect to that example with leather.

Sure tanning leather can have 24h timer, until it's complete. But... you can tan 1 leather, 2 leathers, 15 leathers in paralel.

So if you didn't tan 2 leathers today, you can tan extra 2 tomorrow, and you didn't miss a thing.

If you however miss doing "daily quest" today, you can't simply do the double job tomorrow, you missed that reward forever.

Your example can illustrate my point I believe. Sure you can decide to just tan 1 leather. Or 15. There are plenty of dailies that allow you to do it once or multiple times a day in that regard as well.

But you are limited on how many leathers you can tan. For example. Say I had 15 tanning tubs. If I missed a day I can't "Just do double the job tomorrow". Not unless I had room for 15 more tanning tubs and wanted to take the time to create them. Which could take awhile since Tree's have a long timer as well. If I missed two days I couldn't just do triple the leather. At that point I would need 45 tanning tubs and my whole claim would have to basically be just tanning tubs.

Missing a day on a event that is daily is the same as missing the reward on a daily quest. In both situations you don't put in the time and you don't get the reward. In regards to daily quest the limit is sometimes imposed on you (WoW use to have a daily quest limit you could do) or in the case of a daily event it is based on how many tanning tubs you are willing to build/keep in your territory. There is a hard cap to this number.

@Gothix said in Your favorite Dailies, or what you would like to see them as.:

If we are arguing semantics and also bringing RL in...

Then "daily" just means something that you do every day, and it in no way has any cool down tied to that activity.

You eat daily, but there is no cool down, so you can eat as much as often as you want (that not being healthy is another issue).

---

If one simply wants to convert a world to be used in a field (like gaming) than you have to consider what that word means for the "most" individuals in this field (in this case players).

"Daily" imho. for most players means a quest that you do 1 time per day, that has cool down of 24 hours.

I don't think I have ever eaten and been told I have to wait 24 hours for the next day to eat. Eating could be an hourly endeavor. Or activity you do every minute.

If a Tree has a 24 hour timer-Daily.
If leather has a 24 hour timer-Daily.
If farming has a 24 hour timer-Daily.

Activities that you simply do every day in game, "most" players do not call dailies. When you hear daily, in your mind is something else.

I agree with you on this when it comes to leveling. But once it comes to Endgame where you played all the content you want and have a daily routine you still must do those things would still count as daily to me (This is subjective, and you may have a different opinion but neither of us can really be right or wrong on this).

For example since we are using real life. I have a daily jog/run I do. Could I run all day, or several times a day? Yes. But do I? No. I run once. Daily.

@FibS said in Your favorite Dailies, or what you would like to see them as.:

@Whisper

[...] even if there was a governing body that said, "A game must use an NPC or narrator for a mechanic to constitute a quest otherwise it is not a quest even if mechanically it is functioning exactly like one".

This is the de facto standard use of the term "quest" in an RPG setting. If you don't activate it through some trigger entity - at the very least, activating with an announcement when you walk into an area and something questy is obviously present - then it's not called a quest.

Achievements, for instance, are effectively quests that are already "taken" at the start of the game, and can be completed as soon as their objectives are encountered. They are never called quests in standard parlance, even though literally the only difference is you never talked to an NPC to start it.

It wouldn't change the argument being made here [...] Fractured has content that happens daily.

Every online game in the world has repetitive content. Most entire games can be considered a daily / weekly / etc. Most entire games could be considered a quest, too ("get to the maximum level" etc. etc.)

But that would just be silly, so for the sake of cohesion, the only content generally counted as dailies and quests (and daily quests) are formalized checklists that are presented as such.

The following daily / weekly concepts are usually not counted when people talk about dailies / weeklies / et al:

• paying insurance or maintenance for house claims, guild taxes, etc.
• regular bidding for contested things (like market spots in ESO)
• resting XP
• seasons / leagues / monthly PVP brackets
• daily or otherwise restocking purchase offers

Can you link that dictionary you used earlier? I googled it, parts of it, just the name and nothing comes up.

For the sake of argument, since it is not the point, lets just call them Dailies then like the title suggest. No one here has suggested, "Let's tie to to an NPC that says, "Daily Quest here!". In fact we have said the opposite. Many times. The best dailies are integrated into the game.

Fractured has content that is tied to a 24 hour timer. That is a daily. I never played an entire game where each thing you do is tied to a 24 hour timer. Kill a bunny gone for 24 hours. Never seen that. Use a resource gone for 24 hours. Turn in a resource don't get the reward for 24 hours.

I wish there was a third option that desired a mixture of the two.

@Jetah said in Your favorite Dailies, or what you would like to see them as.:

@Whisper said in Your favorite Dailies, or what you would like to see them as.:

Not if they finish all the content and there is no longer a reason to login.

If you think the content what e.g. Fractured offers gathering, crafting, farming, building, trading, OWPvP, sieges, dungeons, asteroids, skill progressions, exploring... every single aspect of the game is better option to spend time in the game than daily quest in every way.

You realize Fractured has daily content as well that is locked behind 24 timelocks right? (We refer to that as dailies).

fractured will have 1200 skill/ranks to unlock. some behind karma walls (ie you have to be full good to get some; you have to be full bad to get others). it will have constant battles (even on the fury planet) which will cause gear to be stolen. i even assume they'll have a decay system for gear; i know they'll have a decay for houses, plot, buildings. then you add in the political game. i just don't see someone being "done" in a sandbox game as sandbox games aren't treadmill games where you have a defined ending (for an expansion or the 'game').

Gear currently has durability that causes it to break when it reaches zero. I agree the game has content other than it's dailies. I hope I didn't give the impression that I thought daily content should be the only content. Fractured has a lot more to offer than that. Daily content should never be the bread and butter of the game. It should be something to encourage daily logins

and daily content isn't daily quest. you are combining the two when they're separate. quest you seek out to do, whereas daily content is just there like killing rabbits for a days/week worth of food, getting enough materials to repair your buildings, farms, plot. Getting enough gear to handle being killed (pvp or npc); being looted or for climate differences. Then we'll have livestock which may have to be fed daily. That's the difference between daily quest and daily content.

If it makes you feel better drop the "Daily Quest" part. They are the same mechanically different in name only. Like the title of this thread points out I have no problem just calling it dailies.

Quest are more brainless chores. go kill 50 rats. bring this package to ms wastetime. escort ms wastetime to the outhouse. bring resources to the smith. those are daily quest we hate.

Brainless dailies are. It only takes a little work to integrate them into the game and make them more seamless.

I 100% agree with you that the daily quest you describe and have been describing is a horrible approach to a daily system. And I have not once advocated for any of the ideas you have suggested as the bad examples. I think anytime someone pointed out they didn't like daily quest because of a certain example I have pointed out that no one is suggesting using those bad examples.

I think the daily system Fractured has is the best approach. It is integrated into their world.

@FibS

Could you link to the source for that? Not that it really changes the debate much unless the MMO Community came together to force definitions that explicitly state what can constitute a quest and what can not.

Hypothetically speaking even if there was a governing body that said, "A game must use an NPC or narrator for a mechanic to constitute a quest otherwise it is not a quest even if mechanically it is functioning exactly like one".

It wouldn't change the argument being made here because I am not saying, "An NPC MUST dictate we do these!".

In fact I have many times said the opposite when I keep repeatedly pointing out that the current system is integrated into the game with a 24 hour timer (Daily) and has claim/city maintenance (Weekly/Monthly). The word daily quest was never the crux of my argument.

So even if that situation existed it would just be me pointing out then sure, "Just change the word Daily quest to Daily like the title of this topic" since everything I suggested fits perfect into a daily and I never once mentioned an NPC giving quest, or a narrator.

But, I don't think that is the issue since I have many times suggested we could drop the word Daily Quest and just call it a Daily but this point keeps being made. I assume because people cannot argue daily doesn't means something happens once a day, and Fractured has content that happens daily.

So even though they have came out and specifically stated there is 24 hour content to encourage people to play daily now I have people trying to argue semantics about a word that is irrelevant to the points being made.

@Tuoni said in Your favorite Dailies, or what you would like to see them as.:

@Whisper

Double facepalm because one is simply not enough.

Interesting point on the matter. You really brought your A+ game here.

@Tuoni said in Your favorite Dailies, or what you would like to see them as.:

@Whisper I have not talked about Fractured I have talked about daily quests in general so there is no need to try push those timers in every answer. Those can be discussed separately though.

But it is the answer to the question of this topic. It would be like arguing what 2+2 is. And you saying please stop saying the answer is 4.

Answering with nonsense just shows where you stand with your arguments at the moment.

Then let's keep it simple. I asked what peoples favorite dailies are. We learned fractured is using a 24 hour timer for dailies. People who support dailies like a system where it is integrated so it makes them (generally) happy. People who dislike daily quest are okay with it because it is not called a daily quest so it makes them (generally) happy.

It makes it a good system for both sides.

Even you would like to call daily quest something else or compare those to daily activities, I have made it perfectly clear what I mean by daily quests. I have said that when I mention daily quests I refer to the original meaning back in time of WoW Burning Crusade. Blizzard implemented the original daily quest concept which others have copied since then.

You can call dailies what you want. It doesn't change the fact a daily is something that happens daily. Fractured has mechanics that have a 24 hour timer which is... a daily.

At first daily quests can feel supportive but with time those will turn to burden and feel like a job. Very basic pattern for daily quests.

You realize Fractured has dailies in the form of 24 hour timers, right? As well as a weekly (or monthly) in the form of maintenance for claims/cities.

So you can say "absolutly not" with assurance based on your unconsciousness? It is a very basic stuff to stretch the current content with help of daily quests (e.g. WoW, FF14, Archaege) so basically people are playing the same content over and over again. Those games which have not used daily quest system to repeat the current content are using at least the example number 1.

I am saying what you said is absolutely not what I said, or anyone else in this thread. Period. Then I moved on to saying I never seen a game do that. Then I acknowledged it is possible a game has but then pointed out even if one has that is a terrible idea. Hope that clarifies it for you.

You realize your examples prove you wrong though, right? Those games have dailies and they still have expansions (New Content). .

Again. This thread wasn't, "What is the absolute worst type of Dailies, and lets use those ones". It is, "Your favorite dailies, or what you would like to see them as".

Perhaps you should check your original post before making this kind of argument.

Look at the title. What does it say? I am using the words interchangeably because they are functionally exactly the same. If it makes you happy anytime I said Daily Quest just pretend I said Daily.

"What are some games you think have done them right? What kind of daily quest would you like to see? Or they just an obstacle you would rather not be there?"

And as we are shown they prefer to use an integrated system that has 24 timers (Daily), and weekly (or monthly) maintenance on claims/cities. It's a good system.

These are not daily quests and I have not been against these like I have several times mentioned before.

If your only argument is, "I don't like the word quest" then, okay just call them daily. Issue fixed!

Have you noticed that rarely any thread gets only positive approach to the topic and it is quite common to have differing opinions. Moreover, you do not have to take it as personal insult if I or anyone else presents critical arguments against the daily quests or systems used behind those.

I don't take it personally. I enjoy debating with people

@tulukaruk said in Your favorite Dailies, or what you would like to see them as.:

Tending to farm is a sandbox daily quest
It all depends on how we look at things. What you mentioned are exactly the dailies I'd like to see here.

Additionally maybe some minor divine stuff daily as well to prove your devotion - like praying daily (as it will be a big part of the game, at least for my demon fighting for redemption).

Good points. It does seem the crux of the issue here is the way people view the word Daily/Daily Quest. Even though mechanically they could be exactly the same that extra word appears to trigger people, lol.

I like your idea as well. Could give a new simple blue print to build as well (For a little shrine in your house to pray at).

With daily quests players are encouraged / forced to login daily basis by the Developers.

Encouraged yes. Only a bad daily would force a player to login. That is what makes it feel like a job.

The Developers does not need to create new content when they can recycle the old one with repeatable quests.

Absolutely not. I am not even sure where this came from. I haven't ever seen an MMO forego new content and instead just used dailies. I mean, it probably has happened and is a perfect example of what not to do.

Again. This thread wasn't, "What is the absolute worst type of Dailies, and lets use those ones". It is, "Your favorite dailies, or what you would like to see them as".

And as we are shown they prefer to use an integrated system that has 24 hour timers (Daily), and weekly (or monthly) maintenance on claims/cities. It's a good system.

@Gothix said in Your favorite Dailies, or what you would like to see them as.:

While it may take a day to craft leather, you may for example also steal that leather from someone else, or purchase it, or... (other sources of obtaining it, without cooldown)... You are not forced to do this daily activity, and you can still get that item in another ways.

But this is still not the point, as I said, the main point is psychological effect "daily quests" have on players.

I feel like that is an unfair example because as many have stated they prefer their daily quest to offer unimportant items, that aren't unique to them and don't force you to do them.

It would be like if I asked someone if they liked Oranges and they replied no because if you eat a rotten one they taste nasty. And then someone saying what about this fresh one that isn't rotten?

I completely agree with you that some dailies are excessive and cumbersome (This statement is in my starting post) and some dailies use high tier items that are unique to them. Both of these are the worse way to do them (Rotten if you will).

However, there are plenty of dailies that don't do that. That can feel integrated into the game and just highlight what you were already going to do (Fresh if you will).

Fractured's daily system is integrated into the game with daily timers (Nodes/Resources/Farming/Etc) and Weekly (or monthly) claim maintence. Which makes me think you are 100% right on the issue really being psychological since we had someone go from hating the idea of daily quest to thankful that the game just uses 24 hour timers to get people to login daily lol.