Crafting, and "long term goals" of community/devs
OK, for a little clarification:
Some people, myself included, think that the only change to crafting should be to lower all metal requirements to make metal crafting easier. This would put it on par with wood/cloth.
Other people seem to feel that all of the "t2" armors, should be as difficult as metal. Thus making all crafting more of a time and resource sink.
They have come up with ideas of how to make the wood/cloth more difficult, such as certain wood only used for houses not crafting. Also, something that was talked about was making lesser/greater type woods. That if you used a lesser wood you would get a lesser weapon/shield.
I hope that this adds some clarification to what I mean in the poll. Sorry for any confusion, if this does not clear things up, please help me to make things clear, so that we can find out what the "majority" of players that come to the forums would prefer to happen.
If you have some other kind of recommendation, please leave it in replies, and the choices may be updated. I've left being able to update your vote ON, so new choices should not be an issue.
@FahQ i didn't understand what you asking in the poll, and what is the answer.
so i say, there should be a lot more items not only t1 and t2.
the time for the items is good, but the grind for the enchants are too high.
@grofire I've added some more details as to my thoughts. I apologize for not being very clear earlier. I have a habit (unfortunately) of not explaining well to others, as the thoughts are complete in my mind, and I just presume I am being clear enough for others
Friends in real life/family have often asked me wtf im talking about, because I'm doing this.
I voted option 3.
I'm okay with a meet in the middle approach where metal is still detailed and time locked, but maybe less ingots per suit or shave some time off smelting, but add mayhap a little to smiting.
As for wood, leather and cloth, t1 is fine for cloth as is (and t1 metal is definitely one that needs a quicker grade) but t1 leather could possibly use a quicker option. Hide might be okay, but maybe a middleground between hide and leather. Like studded/reinforced hide that might use an ingot to make studs/reinforced pieces.
T2, cloth especially needs a time sink. More than just the bonus reagents needed because let's face it, Crystallized Nagic is tge most common t2 Armor rare, used on the cheapest(time-wise) armors.
Cloth for t2 armor should maybe need a pretreatment of ground chipped gemstone or something, that takes an hour or 2.
T1 wood weapons are easy, t2 should probably go with a wood quality grade o. Logs as Spoletta often advises. Either special trees need to drop mostly Hardwood or something, and 1 to 2 of their special woods, or drop 2 different qualities of that wood, with lesser quality wood either having lower durability when crafted, or maybe needing a lacquer or pretreatment to improve their quality.
@GamerSeuss imo, this is basically option 2. not 3.
yall are also thinking about balance now, when t3 recipes are on the horizon. I voted for 3 but I think I am more in line with 1. Nerf the time sink for metals and increase their durability. The mats required for t2 sets stay the same. thats my 2 cents
@Junkie u can change/update vote.....
@FahQ partly, as I don't think cloth needs as much time sink as metal, and as I said, I'd add a middleground metal and possibly leather option and adjust some, but I'm not going either extreme.
Metal should be more intensive so starter characters without a support structure have to take a small amount of time to enter tge metal arena of play. This is because melee builds are gear dependent builds, and that gear shouldn't be dirt easy to upgrade to from leather/hide.
With a support structure, sure...your friends or guild can outfit you, but on your own, it should take a minute to go from primitive to tge metal age
(...)when t3 recipes are on the horizon(...)
Not just T3, but alchemy and asteroids are going to change (or at least should change) balance. I've said it before, but I'm continue saying it, don't focus on balancing now, focus on implementing functionality/features/content. DS has a tight schedule and already needs to postpone important, game changing features, like taming, past launch (which isn't good). Worry about balancing in the last two month before release, when you (hopefully) have a feature stop and the focus is solely on testing (I know it won't happen, but that's what should happen).
@FahQ im gonna stay with 3 because I think we still need discuss this further, and we have to see what the future holds
The following would be my ideal system:
All refining station can accept up to 99 of each item, and will keep working until they have materials inside. Having to load them again and again is not very casual friendly.
Smelting time to get regular ingots changed to 6 hours (to compensate for the fact that they will run without requiring a refill every 4 hours). The 16 hours of tubs is instead reduced to 12.
Smelters renamed to "Kiln" and advanced smelter to "Advanced Kiln", so that they are applicable to wood curing too (potentially also for alchemy).
Tanning tubs renamed to generic "Tubes", which are used for leather, cloth and hide.
Add a small charcoal pile blueprint, which occupies a 1x1 slot. Takes 8 wood and produces 4 charcoal in 6 hours. Personal plots rarely have the space to build the big ones. It is quicker but less efficient than the big ones, making it good for small self productions.
Limit of 1 kiln and one tube for each personal plot. Limit of 4 kiln per blacksmith and carpenter building. Limit of 4 tubs per tailor building. Limit of 2 tub and 2 kiln per workshop building.
T1 metal armors use "low purity" ingots, which are made in a second tab of the kiln in 10 minutes using only 2 ores and half the normal temperature. This way you can craft yourself a full plate with a little more than one cart of ore and 4 hours total of smelting. Reduce the durability of chainmail and plate armor to compensate.
Increase by a wide margin the durability of t2 metal armors.
All cloths, leather and hide need to be soaked in the tub before being used. This produces a "Cured" version of the base material. This is made in a second tab of the tub and takes 4 hours. These cured materials can be used for all t1 crafting.
For t2 you require the "Pristine" version which takes the standard 16 hours and produce 2 pristine materials for each 5 materials placed in. This may also require a specific technology respectively for cloth and leather/hide. Slightly increase durability of the t2 armors.
Wood logs before being chopped into planks need to be cured in a Kiln. Identical process to smelting ingots. Each wood has its required temperature. Hardwood and softwood cannot be cured, they are only for charcoal piles and for buildings. Each tree gives only 1 log of its specific wood and the rest in hardwood. Each log when cut gives 2 planks. Change the cost of all wood productions (including shields) to 1 plank. Decrease the durability of wood weapons, so that they are balanced in effort/durability with the metal ones.
All shields are brought to t2 tech level, with corresponding recipes.
All in all this reduces the grind of t2 dropped materials (since all t2 armors get increased durability), but makes it so that cloth/leather/hide armors have an actual cost of base resources instead of only dropped t2 costs (like the metal armors).
It makes crafting t1 metal and leather armors far easier for the solo player, but less braindead to make hide and cloth ones.
Keeps wooden crafts as the easier version of the metal crafts, but brings them to be at least in the same ballpark.
Gives each plot a value in being able to refine a certain amount of resources, and this becomes a source of income for the solo players. This also ties the owners of a city more to its residents, since they are good providers of the refined materials once the city develops that tech. The city can only produce so much without getting help from residents, or it has to invest in additional crafting buildings, which has its own issues.
And now I have spent 2 hours writing a post which no one will read, and that for sure will not be implemented because it implies too much dev time
@spoletta I read your post and first I have to say TUBS!!!!!!!!!. Also, you want to redo everything... that's a little excessive dont you think?
Your very vital feedback has been taken in consideration and tubs have finally found justice.