Will we have a kill count in pvp?
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@finland said in Will we have a kill count in pvp?:
@chrightt noobs are weeker but you can't develop a system to recognize them ;).
If you define the term 'noobs' by 'newbie' and thus 'newcomer/beginner', then you can easily use time played. If you define the term 'noobs' as in people with a bad skill in PvP, then there's always the possibility of an ELO ranking.
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@finland Even if there are low increments, higher lvl skills will give an edge. It's the same for better gear (crafted with better materials, by a much more skilled craftsman). There WILL, therefore be a straight forward power difference between a new player and a veteran. If you factor in the fact that the veteran has more experience with the gameplay, and the "feel" of his kit as well as how his opponent's kit performs, we have quite the power gap between the two. I'm not saying this is bad. It's in fact good. There needs to be some form of progression... still, stating that there will be no power difference between players as a justification for something you want or don't want in the game is... well... sophistic to say the least.
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@finland Even without level these "pvp" hunters will know after one kill. Actually, it is easy to tell who is experienced and who isn't in a game if you have enough experience. Certainly having no level does make it harder for some, but I usually find level to not be the best indicator of a player's abilities.
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@logain said in Will we have a kill count in pvp?:
@finland said in Will we have a kill count in pvp?:
@chrightt noobs are weeker but you can't develop a system to recognize them ;).
If you define the term 'noobs' by 'newbie' and thus 'newcomer/beginner', then you can easily use time played. If you define the term 'noobs' as in people with a bad skill in PvP, then there's always the possibility of an ELO ranking.
You can't have an MMR system for an openworld PvP
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@darian said in Will we have a kill count in pvp?:
@finland Even if there are low increments, higher lvl skills will give an edge. It's the same for better gear (crafted with better materials, by a much more skilled craftsman). There WILL, therefore be a straight forward power difference between a new player and a veteran. If you factor in the fact that the veteran has more experience with the gameplay, and the "feel" of his kit as well as how his opponent's kit performs, we have quite the power gap between the two. I'm not saying this is bad. It's in fact good. There needs to be some form of progression... still, stating that there will be no power difference between players as a justification for something you want or don't want in the game is... well... sophistic to say the least.
A veteran is supposed to have just more skill. Not always true! You can play a game 3 years and stay newbie/low. What I'm trying to say is that's impossible judge the power of a player in an open world pvp sandbox. The only way to keep a track is an MMR system but you need instanced pvp match like happens for moba! Anyway as I said before i like the idea to have a resume diary BUT not something to say I killed someone stronger or weaker. You can't track it!
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@chrightt said in Will we have a kill count in pvp?:
@finland Even without level these "pvp" hunters will know after one kill. Actually, it is easy to tell who is experienced and who isn't in a game if you have enough experience. Certainly having no level does make it harder for some, but I usually find level to not be the best indicator of a player's abilities.
Yeh but that's your opinion based on your skill if you kill or you have been killed by someone. You can't make/develop a system that recognize that. 10 level difference make it easy for a system to judge who is strong and who is weak. Gear will have a soft impact so you can't judge on the level/tier difference between 2 players.
Anyway how would you judge individually the player who is strong and who is weak in a a zerg fight 50vs50? Or in a gank 1vs10? You will be killed by they could have been weaker than you!
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@finland said in Will we have a kill count in pvp?:
You can't have an MMR system for an openworld PvP
You don't need one for an adjusted ELO system to work.
@finland said in Will we have a kill count in pvp?:
Anyway how would you judge individually the player who is strong and who is weak in a a zerg fight 50vs50?
Same as you do in a 5 vs 5 MOBA battle?
@finland said in Will we have a kill count in pvp?:
Or in a gank 1vs10? You will be killed by they could have been weaker than you!
I know you don't like and don't want to hear that, but if players puts themselves in a situation where they can be tag-teamed, the blame is on them. Map-awareness, strategical positioning, communication (and social interaction), preparation, all that is part of PvP and should be rated accordingly.
Keep on your toes, know when you can go where you plan to go, know when you have what amount of support and how fast it can get to your position, have an escape plan and set your gear/skills according to the situation, but as well to expected PvP and you can limit the amount of times when you find yourself in such a situation.
That said, you can track, weight and evaluate individual contribution to a battle (A healed B, A hit B,...) so you can easily apply Fuzzy Logic here.
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I'd prefer to have a number of each race and sex i've killed or that i've died to. most games just say you've died 8 times but i'd like to see 2 deaths from blood demon, 4 deaths from shadow demons, 1 death from nheedra and 1 death from chadra.
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People here is missing the fact that it's not a competitive game but an MMORPG. If they will implement pvp events like arena/capture the flag/controll points and so on you will see a ranking system. Otherwise is useless.
@Jetah indeed a normal recap diary! I hope to see it too. Also about resources earned and combat outputs
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@finland said in Will we have a kill count in pvp?:
People here is missing the fact that it's not a competitive game but an MMORPG. If they will implement pvp events like arena/capture the flag/controll points and so on you will see a ranking system. Otherwise is useless.
@Jetah indeed a normal recap diary! I hope to see it too. Also about resources earned and combat outputs
the game is a full loot pvp sandbox. that's pretty competitive, more so than a moba or instanced pvp.
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@Jetah competitive is where you scale up rankings not if a game desing makes a playstyle harder. I don't see competition on ganking people or sieging. That's just pvp. Competitions are like tournaments to prove who's the best.
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@logain said in Will we have a kill count in pvp?:
@finland said in Will we have a kill count in pvp?:
You can't have an MMR system for an openworld PvP
You don't need one for an adjusted ELO system to work.
@finland said in Will we have a kill count in pvp?:
Anyway how would you judge individually the player who is strong and who is weak in a a zerg fight 50vs50?
Same as you do in a 5 vs 5 MOBA battle?
@finland said in Will we have a kill count in pvp?:
Or in a gank 1vs10? You will be killed by they could have been weaker than you!
I know you don't like and don't want to hear that, but if players puts themselves in a situation where they can be tag-teamed, the blame is on them. Map-awareness, strategical positioning, communication (and social interaction), preparation, all that is part of PvP and should be rated accordingly.
Keep on your toes, know when you can go where you plan to go, know when you have what amount of support and how fast it can get to your position, have an escape plan and set your gear/skills according to the situation, but as well to expected PvP and you can limit the amount of times when you find yourself in such a situation.
That said, you can track, weight and evaluate individual contribution to a battle (A healed B, A hit B,...) so you can easily apply Fuzzy Logic here.Fractured will have large scale sieges. There will certainly be moments where good players get clobbered by large groups of noobs.
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@finland said in Will we have a kill count in pvp?:
@Jetah competitive is where you scale up rankings not if a game desing makes a playstyle harder. I don't see competition on ganking people or sieging. That's just pvp. Competitions are like tournaments to prove who's the best.
competition is saying someone is better than another. sieges are a competition. open world pvp is a competition. ganking is a competition.
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Competitive is when you win someting like a rank position not killing others. Medieval age had wars and competitions (like tournaments). Competition is something fun instead war is war.
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@finland said in Will we have a kill count in pvp?:
Competitive is when you win someting like a rank position not killing others. Medieval age had wars and competitions (like tournaments). Competition is something fun instead war is war.
uh, they also fought over land and political positions. similar to GoT (as i understand it as i don't watch it nor read the books). it was a competition to get troops, supplies to best the other side.
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@finland I'm talking more about a small group situation where its 1v1, 1v2, 2v2 etc where you can easily discern individuals. Anyways, even if you don't "judge" a veteran with high af knowledge tree will just say "screw it" and go ahead and farm scrubs (which can be seen from area or remembering IGNs of stronger people) or even just farm afks. Point is I think the pvp kill count is a horrible idea, who cares about the rest of this.
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@chrightt it's superfluous but someone might be interested in knowing how many tiger kin he has killed so far (for example).
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@chrightt I like knowing who've i've killed and who i've died to. I also like knowing total currency obtained and more!
