Armour damage absorption: procentual, flat or combination?



  • Will armour absorb attacks procentually (like in WoW), flat ( like in Grim Dawn) or their combination (like in Path of Exile)?

    Im asking this, because in arpg PVP "dmg is king but speed kills" and im afraid, that if guy with dexterity 25, dual wielding and with speed attack enchant on both weapons and activated Frenzy ability (and maybe some other attack speed bonus):

    1. will take maces, ill get permastunned ( unless ther is cooldown on passive weapon stun)
    2. I´ll get attacked X times, before my slower weapon even attacks enemy (just like a bear who got slowed in alpha video and poked to death by spear user with hit and run tactics). I know it takes some skill to kite someone in melee, but irl i hate fighting spears and this is easily abusable.

    And most importatntly: if two attackers facetank each other, will 2h damage be balanced to dual wielding dps ? Don´t know how dual wielding attacks speed is calculated, but im sure once you spec into attack speed, you´ll reach 3 attacks per second easily. Two handed weapon swings 0,8 times a second and my guess is two handers will rather go damage route. In WoW having superslow but superdamaging 2H weapon was risky - if you critted twice in the row, you probably won. If you missed twice in the row you were in trouble.
    In GRIM DAWN armour takes role of lowering the physical damage flat way - so massive two handed weapons still dish out big numbers. In Path of Exile armor reduces phys damage procentually, but the bigger physical DMG you receive, the more damage goes through - if not, everyone would just max out attack speed (truth is in PoE evryone does).


  • TF#4 - EMISSARY

    @asspirin said in Armour damage absorption: procentual, flat or combination?:

    Will armour absorb attacks procentually (like in WoW), flat ( like in Grim Dawn) or their combination (like in Path of Exile)?

    Im asking this, because in arpg PVP "dmg is king but speed kills" and im afraid, that if guy with dexterity 25, dual wielding and with speed attack enchant on both weapons and activated Frenzy ability (and maybe some other attack speed bonus):

    1. will take maces, ill get permastunned ( unless ther is cooldown on passive weapon stun)
    2. I´ll get attacked X times, before my slower weapon even attacks enemy (just like a bear who got slowed in alpha video and poked to death by spear user with hit and run tactics). I know it takes some skill to kite someone in melee, but irl i hate fighting spears and this is easily abusable.

    Hello! Each armor type has a base armor value and three multipliers, one for each physical resistance type: Slash, Piece and Crush.

    Each resistance is calculated multiplying the base value for the multiplier, rounded down. This is the development of the average Damage Reduction depending on the Armor level.

    damage schema.png

    And most importatntly: if two attackers facetank each other, will 2h damage be balanced to dual wielding dps ? Don´t know how dual wielding attacks speed is calculated, but im sure once you spec into attack speed, you´ll reach 3 attacks per second easily. Two handed weapon swings 0,8 times a second and my guess is two handers will rather go damage route. In WoW having superslow but superdamaging 2H weapon was risky - if you critted twice in the row, you probably won. If you missed twice in the row you were in trouble.
    In GRIM DAWN armour takes role of lowering the physical damage flat way - so massive two handed weapons still dish out big numbers. In Path of Exile armor reduces phys damage procentually, but the bigger physical DMG you receive, the more damage goes through - if not, everyone would just max out attack speed (truth is in PoE evryone does).

    We don't want to create a distinct advantage between speed and damage. We tested that with the Max Attack speed bonus (+50%) you can reach about 2 APS. In general, both double wielded weapons and two-handed weapons builds are the ones that make more DPS, the first ones are more reliable than the second that are riskier but more destructive.



  • @Znirf Amazing, thank you for detailed information.


  • TF#4 - EMISSARY

    The interesting part will be when people decide to specialise in a single resistant type at one time.


  • TF#12 - PEOPLE'S HERALD

    Thats for those sweet details! 🙂


  • TF#12 - PEOPLE'S HERALD

    @Znirf

    We need a spotlight at this point. I know it won’t be specific but some developer philosophies would be great.



  • Now after watching the gameplay with "Shield block" ability it seems to me that power difference between 2h and sword and board further increases.
    SB ability blocks attack once in like 6 seconds, which impacts mainy assassins ( who probably attack from invis for some nasty backstab ... if such ability will be blocked) and slow attacking dudes with 2h. Lets say two characters (one with 1h+ board, other with 2h, both having same attributes and tier of equipment) attack each other.
    They should have same dps, but even now dude with shield has advantage with armour from shield. If he also uses SB, he blocks some of attacks of 2h user. Whats more, 2h attacks are slower - lets say at 50% of speed of fast 1h. If 1h would do 10 attacks and one is blocked, he still deals 90% of his damage, however slower 2h deals just 5 attack during same moment, so if one of these is blocked, he misses 20% of dps. If shield users have Shiled block, will there be similar toggable abilities for 2H users specialised for damage (something like "every 6 seconds deal guaranteed double damage / crit", or "toggle to add 15 - 40 damage to your attacks" or soimething similar to WoW ability Overpower - "if enemy evades twice in row, next attack hits" - because low attack speed also handicaps you against high evasion enemy - every missed swing hurts you twice more than twice faster 1h user.
    Im really curious about how dual wielding will be solved, it most probably will be "damage oriented setup". If so, 2h builds might suck (unless high crit specced).

    P.S: When enchanting, do 2h weapons get twice stronger enchants (like 24% melee damage instead of 12% etc.) or twice more slots for enchants? Does anyone know? Thank you


  • TF#12 - PEOPLE'S HERALD

    @asspirin

    i dont think i've seen double enchants potency but i have seen twice the number of enchants. question is if a certain ability allows for dual 2h.



  • @Jetah lets hope Monkey grip will not get into Fractured, it looks super silly 😄
    And thanks for the answer.


  • TF#12 - PEOPLE'S HERALD

    @asspirin said in Armour damage absorption: procentual, flat or combination?:

    @Jetah lets hope Monkey grip will not get into Fractured, it looks super silly 😄
    And thanks for the answer.

    never heard of monkey grip referred to dual 2h.

    oh, diablo 3 has higher enchant power for 2h, iirc. so there could be one!



  • @Jetah Well, in WoW it´s called Titan grip, youre right, not sure where I heard it before 🙂
    However using even 1kg 1h sword or axe is exhausting as well after a while, using 2h weapon in one hand looks ridiculous 😄

    diablo 3 has higher enchant power for 2h, iirc. so there could be one!

    So does GRIM DAWN, hopefully enchantable bonuses on 2h will be increased.


  • TF#12 - PEOPLE'S HERALD

    @asspirin

    it's strength that allows you to use 2. i dont think it looks bad unless the models for the weapons are 4x the size of the player.



  • @Jetah 2h axe has centre of gravity too far - not usable; 2h mace is even worse in this matter - not usable; 2h sword - although better balanced than axe, still not very usable because any 2h weapon in one hand is extremely slow (weights like 2kg); 2h pole weapon (spear for example) - problem with range (same as with spear used in both hands = if enemy is closer that 1,5m, drop your spear and use sax/axe ). Also pole weapons (axe, spear) are easily grabbed; if 2his used in one hand, you basically give your weapon to enemy 😄 Also no matter how strong you are, you cant stop your 2h weapon mid swing and whats worse you can´t feint neither. If you attack unarmed guy irl with two 2h weapons the unarmed dude will have upper hand.

    ...not mentioning narrow spaces, where you cant even swing

    I know, it´s a fantasy game, but please don´t make it full anime.


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