"To fight a losing battle, and not lose it"
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A few notes on the current test; primarily PvP and the criminal system, as well as a few other bits and pieces.
Looting players
Im not sure if it was because the player died (DoT) while inside a town safe zone, but can good players loot defeated evil players?PvP/ Economical Alignment
I may be mistaken about a few points here, but as I understand it:
*Good players cannot commit crimes, or loot evil players they have defeated.
*Evil players must be defeated by a bounty hunter to be subject to any punishment.
*Most PvP players seem to be of evil alignment, and most good players seem to be focusing on building, farming and crafting.Given these points, as well as the fact that the larger guilds seem to be the main evil PvP players at the moment, the situation appears thus:
PvP characters of evil alignment travel in large groups, good players either have small groups or go solo, focusing on PvE.Bounty hunters are severely outnumbered, PvE players get ganked and their equipment taken, evil players have no countering force and do not risk losing equipment, making evil alignment the only viable PvP alignment, and luck the only hope of the solo player.
Fractured is purported to support all play styles, and if completed as describe will certainly do so, however, there is currently no opposition to PvP players, and with all players combined on a single planet, indeed a single continent, the density of evil players to good players is problematic; none of the measures to mitigate undesired Player Killing are in existence or in effect.
Due to these facts, and to improve testing of sieges, the primary purpose of this test i believe, I would suggest that good players need to band together to provide a viable counter-balance to the current situation. (PvP players are united by purpose, where other players have a variety of interests and so are often divided)
As much as I personally, and I'm sure most other players, wish to do their own thing, given this is a test and that the pursuit of personal interests will be cut short leaving no legacy, perhaps we need to band together as players and focus on the testing so as to enjoy the completed game that much sooner.
It has been suggested, by one @Nekrage, that the other worlds should be dropped from the concept, and that Fractured should be focused more on PvP.
I would hope that this will not happen, as it is the other aspects of the game that drew me to it, and that have kept me here despite growing fears those aspects will never be realised.
For these to flourish, indeed in my opinion for the game itself to become anything special, and not just another hack'n'slash, the three worlds MUST all be included; a game that is only simulated farming and crafting is, even in my opinion, boring, and yet what beauty can come from a game that is purely combat?The duality (Triality?) of Fractured has the potential to make it a brilliant game; and to settle for less than the lofty goals described in the early newsletters and the wiki, will be sure to see Fractured fail as a success, and more importantly, fail to become the beautiful game it might be.
To quote a character in one of my favourite books: "The point is to play a beautiful game" (a wise mans fear, Patrick Rothfuss)@Nekrage has also expressed dissatisfaction with other games that "build their entire game around PvE and punish players interested in PvP"
I would like to counter this with the suggestion that all games, to whatever degree, punish PvN players, namely players that would rather play the same game, and yet solve their problems some way other than by hitting it over the head with a heavy object.I feel obliged to justify my position here: I do not ask for a game that makes it easy to avoid combat, I have just now said that conflict is necessary to keep dullness at bay, nor do I ask for a game that negatively affects players desiring combat, I understand that most gamers see it as a must.
All I ask is for a game in which it is POSSIBLE to avoid killing, and still engage in all other aspects of the game; this is something Fractured has proposed already, namely ways of learning skills without killing the thing, but has yet to implement, and which I implore the developers not to cut out of the game.Fractured has proposed a game wherein I am sure @Nekrage will be able to engage in unfettered PvP, and I will be able to create a character able to experience all but one of the games aspects without the need to end the virtual life of a single player or creature.
Fractured, should it achieved its aims, would be a game that comes close to satisfying the two of us, and I would have no problem with having Nekrage's hordes devastate my lands, slaughter myself and my comrades and bear off as plunder the fruits of our labour, though my comrades may be a little put out.
However.
This does require the completion of the game entire; as the game is now; a single landmass with incomplete systems and a small inconsistent player base, there is really no place for players running about in large groups intent on slaying and looting everything that moves, though that thing be a player seeking to strengthen himself and his city in preparation of testing the siege mechanics.
On a lighter note: Horses
Having been twice in a position where a quick get-away was the only chance of survival (or would have been) I have a suggestion about horses/mounts:
What if mounts could be, rather than 'summoned' from a magical 'horse-pocket', they were, when not ridden, drawn along by a tether, from which station either fight or flight might be enacted instantly.In short; you get off your horse and leave it, obediently standing, while you head off to fight. Or, perhaps you are aware that you might have to flee, or fight at a moments notice, therefore you lead the horse. Should battle be joined, you drop the lead and the horse either stands, or runs a short way from where it may be called once combat is ended, or if flight becomes necessary, you run to your mount and leap astride it, going from foot to horse instantly. Perhaps, as you lead your horse, you encounter a menace you cannot defeat, and so, leap straight-way to the saddle and ride away.
I am unsure as to the ease of making this work, but it possibly the mechanics for wagons and carts might be adapted.
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@Mirgannel12 said in "To fight a losing battle, and not lose it":
It has been suggested, by one @Nekrage, that the other worlds should be dropped from the concept, and that Fractured should be focused more on PvP.
Umm...no I didn't. The hell are you talking about?
After skimming this post I see my name THREE times and not a single other player.
Not even reading the rest of your post after that shit.
This is literally a post targeted at attacking me and it's all based off an absolute lie.
Never EVER championed for the removal of the ability to focus on PvE.
I already stated that I am done with these forums for a while because of SHIT like this.
Good luck with this shit brigade.
P.S. Funny how you hide who you are in game and on Discord.
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@Mirgannel12 said in "To fight a losing battle, and not lose it":
*Good players cannot commit crimes, or loot evil players they have defeated.
This is wrong, which I think invalidates your entire argument no? Good players can loot evil players they've killed.
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Think I found out who this is. "Ralph of Upmeads"
We killed him once. This is why this thread was created in the first place. Based on salt and lies.
He also made this salty thread again targeted at me directly.
https://forum.fracturedmmo.com/topic/13946/warfare/3
Keep in mind this is because he died ONCE.
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Well, let's agree, Fractured is supposed to support all three game styles, thats for what we all are here.
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I bet that if the next alpha were pve with focus on trade, ability ballances, and crafting, that there would be a higher player population than there is in our current pvp alpha.
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@OlivePit
The only trouble I see with this (and I am totally on the side of PvE support, as everyone knows) is as Prometheus has said before, much of the mechanical side of PvE has already been ironed out.If the game was going to be pure PvE, they could probably just put in the other races, recipes, talents, and gear, load the full beastiary of monsters/encounterables, and be ready to launch inside of 3-6 months full boar.
As we're still in Alpha testing, the Devs have to test what isn't really working, mechanically. And then react to how some things break or come up when you add other things in. This is why we probably won't see another test that is purely PvE focused, because that part they are good on.
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@Nekrage My player name, most recently, is Ralph of Upmeads, and, as written on my forum profile, my usual player name is Niggle. I am not on Discord for Fractured, I have had some trouble finding the thread? chat? whatever you call it, and I only use discord when I play with a few friends, I have in fact a post or two about players that don't use discord.
You said these words on, what was Sunday night, about 8PM in Australia, not sure what that makes it where you are.
You said, I can't recall the exact words, perhaps you or one of the other OranThul members with you at the time; buckykat, duckfat, rife etc. or perhaps player InvisiblePP with whom you conversed somewhat, but you mentioned that instead of other worlds, there should be multiple servers, and that building was a waste of time, I can't remember exactly what you said about PvP, but you were certainly in support of it.
I don't believe I said you wanted to remove PvE, merely to focus on PvP
I confess I deliberately tagged you multiple times to ensure some response.
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@Rife I did say, at the beginning of the post that I was unsure whether I couldn't loot the player because of alignment or because he had died inside the safe zone
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One point I forgot to put in the original point was that there was no reason for evil players NOT to kill and loot good players after defeating them, as the systems punishing greater karma losses are not in place yet, to my knowledge.
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@Mirgannel12 said in "To fight a losing battle, and not lose it":
You said, I can't recall the exact words, perhaps you or one of the other OranThul members with you at the time; buckykat, duckfat, rife etc. or perhaps player InvisiblePP with whom you conversed somewhat, but you mentioned that instead of other worlds, there should be multiple servers, and that building was a waste of time, I can't remember exactly what you said about PvP, but you were certainly in support of it.
I believe you are really confused by what we were talking about. We rehashed it again on Discord today.
https://i.imgur.com/8bWkUaz.png
https://i.imgur.com/1cQC8UN.png
Happy to talk more if you want.
Honestly man. It seems like my idea suits you more than ANYONE. You seem to DESPISE PvP. One gank and you went a little...bananas. Separate servers keeps you away from me. That's a good thing for everyone in the end. RP'ers with RP'ers and PvP'ers with PvP'ers.
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@Nekrage I am unsure only as to the term you applied to PvP; something along the lines of it being the most worthwhile pursuit in the game, as to the rest, that is almost word for word, but not on discord, it was on the in-game global chat.
You may recall that 'Ralph' said in reply to you that if the other worlds are dropped, the game has failed.I do not despise PvP as such; It is not my favourite playstyle, largely because I tend to suck at it, but also because I find it becomes difficult to treat players as real people, particularly where groups are involved.
The design of Fractured, as planned, seems to me to give all players what they want for most of the time, but still allow them to engage in other playstyles should they want to, all while giving a consistent and 'lore-friendly' setting for those playstyles.
As I have said in the main post, I don't mind engaging in PvP in defending my lands from demon invaders, or the other PvP situations the lore provides.
I like the way the three worlds would have it work, and considering it was the developers idea in the first place, I'm not the only one; I just don't want to see the game become less than it could be.
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@Nekrage out of curiosity, how did you find out my player name?
