Posts made by Tuoni

@Goemoe said in Economy Balance:

@Tuoni Funny, the game we all have waited for, the walking simulator

But no worries, this can be disguised under exploration.

@Specter said in Economy Balance:

@Tuoni said in Economy Balance:

@Sindariya Well I can not decide when I die so it is kind of hard to think all before hand.. Also if people can not store stuff outside of home and guild bank, it will make all activities far from home really annoying. You can basically play mostly in your own hoods.. That sounds kind of bad. I really need an answer from DS side. @Specter

I have no idea, sorry. I'll ask Prometheus once he has time.

I would appreciate that.

@Jetah said in Optional wasd movement?:

@Tuoni
again, I've mentioned at least 3 isometric games with WASD!!!!! the WoW thing was an example sense i didnt know if you've seen the videos of those WASD isometric games.

What it comes to our discussion between you an I, you have only referred to WoW when commenting on my writings. What you have discussed about other people over a year ago is totally irrelevant and not related with my post, where I compared angular and clunky 8 direction moving to smoother moving possibilities with mouse. You should have been referring to one of those isometric MMOs then and not to WoW. I do not know, but it feels like you are just trying to mess up conversations with false arguments and interfering to irrelevant points.

@Target said in How big is the world? By square km:

@Jetah said in How big is the world? By square km:

Tartaros is smaller than the other two. so it'll be much faster to explore.

The size of the planets are different, but the description of each planet implies that they should all have the same amount of playable area.

This is right if Feature Spotlight #2 is still up to date.

"Arboreus is the largest planet of the Elysium Ring, with a surface twice as wide as that of Syndesia – although the area of continents above sea level is roughly equivalent to that of the other planets."

@Target said in Friendly Fire:

@Goemoe said in Friendly Fire:

Where is the gain of friendly fire beside "realism" which isn't that useful in a game anyway?

It adds far more tactical depth to group vs group combat and is a way to counter large unorganized zergs from dominating everything.

Well it makes fights just different, not better. Fights will turn with FF more cautions, and there will be more waiting and less action.. yeah maybe some people like that kind of gameplay and calls it more tactical.

FF is not that good anti-zerging mechanic, because it actually impacts also to smaller groups. Moreover, there is better options for anti-zerging mechanics which does not have any downsides. In addition, if the alignments are involved, then some groups can still run with huge zergs with no need to worry about friendly fire at all. So this will actually promote good alignment zergs. And if there is no party FF (like Jetah wrote) then it won't stop zergs at all.

@Goemoe said in Economy Balance:

@Tuoni said in Economy Balance:

@Sindariya Well I can not decide when I die so it is kind of hard to think all before hand.. Also if people can not store stuff outside of home and guild bank, it will make all activities far from home really annoying. You can basically play mostly in your own hoods.. That sounds kind of bad. I really need an answer from DS side. @Specter

Actually I wonder all the time. The devs tell of removing the "grind" out of the game but add many tedious sounding things into it. After all, each player has a different understand of 'grinding' Some like leveling and quesing a lot. The advancement of the RPG char is the core of such games. Renaming the actions to do so, does not change the system.

Having to carry stuff around, though weight and space matter, might annoy quickling.
Having to explore to get Fractured XP, named knowledge points sound fun, but if you encounter difficult climate conditions large distances away from any access to your belongings might annoy quickly.
Having to reequip your char x times a day because your robbed and or killed many times a day might annoy quickly.
Trying to reach virtually unreachable areas in the game to up you skill, only because you need Tartarus as a beast or Arboreus as a demon will not feel great either.

All this might quickly be viewed upon as grind. It is the risk vs. reward spiral which keep game like this interesting. Which is good. No game like this can work without features some people will name 'grind'

You have really valid points here. Grind can be defined few ways and players experience it differently. Fractured means by grind repeating same stuff over and over again, and I am really glad they have chosen this kind of approach for progression. However, I am a little bit concerned how much there will be pointless traveling especially if our storage possibilities are really limited. Some people can call that easily grind, to me, it is not, and I categorize it as walking simulator. However, it does not matter how people sees this concern, at the end the result is the same, time consuming and not fun activity.

Former Warhammer fan here. I think it is about 15 years when I last time played GamesWorkshop tabletop games. I played basic Bloodbowl, Warhammer, 40K and later Mordheim. Skavens were never my favorite, I liked most High Elves and Undeads (vampires) in Warhammer and I played Chaos in 40K and Orcs in Mordheim. I was disapointed that Warhammer: Age of Reckoning was at the end failure even it had cool characters and epic PvP battles. Now former players have tried for years to get that Warhammer: Return of Reckoning back to feet, but the progression has been really slow.. for understandable reasons ofc.

I can see how 4th race could be a thing post-release and one of the upcoming larger expansions. Then it could actually be own planet with own rules. This is definitely something what devs could push on their backlog. However, I am not sure what that 4th race actually should be.. I like how Fractured has chose fresh races like demons and beastmen, so I would actually like them to continue this path and go with something less generic and commonly used.

But in other hand if we examine Fractured's world more closely, it is kind of mix of middle ages and new age, and maybe the start of the game goes even more further. Back then people's awareness was quite limited, and before enlightenment, almost everyone believed on something. Of course there has always been nonconformists, but there has been so few of them, that maybe there is no need to create atheism at all.

@Gothix said in Optional wasd movement?:

Having a special extra command to put you in or out of combat mode would take a LOT from fluidity of the game and would quite likely be a very hated thing.

What @Darian meant was not extra command, more like if you are in combat then you can not interact with resource nodes for example. So basically the game decides when you are in or out of combat.

@Goemoe said in Economy Balance:

@Goemoe said in Economy Balance:

If npc traders only sell minor amounts of money for the players loot,

pay, not sell. I tried to edit the post above, but it always told me, some spam filter will prevent it

I hope that mobs and animals does not drop any vendor trash, which are meant to sell just like that. All loot should be meaningful, either money (from humanoids) and/or resources used for different crafting.

I personally hope, that consumables like food and drink are also player crafted and we can not buy those from NPCs. Those can easily be part of cooking.

@Goemoe said in Friendly Fire:

there is much to loose with friendly fire, but what is to win by it?

I have thinking the same and I did not find anything reasonable. It is just a feature, which some people like and some people hate. It is nothing special tbh.

@Sindariya Well I can not decide when I die so it is kind of hard to think all before hand.. Also if people can not store stuff outside of home and guild bank, it will make all activities far from home really annoying. You can basically play mostly in your own hoods.. That sounds kind of bad. I really need an answer from DS side. @Specter

@Specter said in Economy Balance:

@Tuoni One the livestreams had a lot of information about traveling. Here's a good summary.

"The devs are considering allowing players to build portals between 2 towns. If they decide to allow this, you will not be able to take any items/equipment through those portals. There would also be limits on how often you could use it."

Yeah, I found this one from there. Thank you for that. This sounds pretty nice option and something what fast traveling should be. This could also be build inside town progression system and maybe contracts between different towns. It can also be ship or carriage routes if that portal thing sounds too easy solution.

@Specter said in Economy Balance:

There are no banks in Fractured. Items can be stored in your own house and guilds can store goods in warehouses built in their cities.

This bothers me a little bit.. What if merchant travels to other cities to sell stuff. Maybe the markets are not pleasing enough and he decides to not be selling. Where he puts all his stuff if he wants to do some other activities in far away from home? He can not take all those stuff with him if he goes for gathering or taking part of open world PvE/PvP actions. And same with every open world activities, I can easily be dead very far away from home and I have no chance to store extra gear sets to closest town to jump back in action. No warehouses chests or banks? Really? How this works then?

@Sindariya said in Economy Balance:

@Tuoni
I agree that the crafting system will play a major role but I'm also worried about the NPCs selling and buying stuff. What I don't want to see are ressources that can only be gained by buying from NPCs. That is a nice gold sink but I really hate such things.
Also NPCs should only sell basic stuff what you can craft in mass. Everything higher should be only made and sold by players.

Well I hope there won't be any NPCs, which are selling stuff or buying those from players. Then we do not have a player-driven economy anymore. So yeah let's hope devs are not even consider this as an option for ingame currency sink.

@Sindariya said in Economy Balance:

@Tuoni
Fast travel is often the dead to every local economy. The economy will than just establish at those travel points. So we have to have a close eye on the travel between the planets.

It depends how the fast travel will be implemented. It can be done so economy won't hurt by it making it cost ingame currency, and way that it costs more than you most likely can get from those items you are wearing or carrying. I am not a huge fan of fast traveling, but few are fine so people can more easily meet up and play with each other.

@Jetah said in Optional wasd movement?:

@Tuoni

it's the click to move part that can hit an interaction. only games with a forced move (poe and Diablo series) or WASD stop that.

Well I already told you how this can be fixed easily. When you are moving you can click either left or right mouse button. Left interacts with environment and right click does not. Also keeping either mouse button down you auto-move and you do not interact with environment. On top of that games can use @Darian 's Combat and out of combat -method. These are very standard ways to handle this interacting problem, so I am once again very irritated of your claims (only forced move) which has zero truth behind.

And what it comes to WASD. We are talking about Fractured here, which is an isometric game, and where you can not use camera to help you with moving. So it is totally vain to use WoW as an example here. You can compare WASD movement to another isometric MMO and you can check out how clunky that 8 direction move can actually look like.

@Meiki If that is the easiest solution, how well every player in game will internalize that..

There is so much involved in Friendly Fire and it can become very complex and overwhelming system to understand correctly. Even this system could be done regardless of the complexicity. It will still have at least two huge challenges to face:

1. FF encourages people for grieffing and toxicity actions.

2. It breaks the balance between melee and ranged.

Oh well, I will just grab popcorns when FF is started to test out.

@Jetah said in Friendly Fire:

@Tuoni said in Friendly Fire:

Before implementing FF, devs needs to ask themselfs, why they want this feature to be part of their game? And does it bring enough value versus all the balancing and exploiting problems?

i'm pretty sure they've already said it was in the game. it and ability interaction with the environment is (a few reasons) why i've backed it.

Maybe, but in what kind of form, would be nice to know. They have not tested Friendly Fire yet and seen what kind of challenges it will cause.

One thing is sure, FF changes combat a lot. Group content will become slower paced and cautious, and the most challenge comes with balancing melee combared to ranged. FF will place tanks and melee dps characters in very bad position and die a lot more than ranged damage dealers. This only was enough big reason for Albion dev team to leave FF feature away from the game.

Second reason was complications with reputation and flag system, which did not go together with FF. This same problem comes in Fractured, but even worse, because planned alignment system. This will cause good amount of exploit possibilities and contradictory situations especially in Syndesia.

Now if DS still decides after testing go with FF, I suggest devs to implement it only for Tartaros and leave Syndesia and Arboreus out of it. That would also leave option to leave alignments totally away from influencing FF.

So I am not personally fan of FF, because it does not bring enough value when compared for problems what it will cause. Actually I do not see anything good beside it can be cool feature in some situations. However, I am waiting that environment interaction as well and it sounds really interesting.

FF is not game breaking feature for me and if they keep that alignment system involved, then I will definitely benefit from this system and start hunting criminals and demons even more what I have planned.

Before implementing FF, devs needs to ask themselfs, why they want this feature to be part of their game? And does it bring enough value versus all the balancing and exploiting problems?

@Sindariya said in Economy Balance:

To many unknown factors so far. How will the storage system be? I read somewhere there will be no bank or world wide access to your inventory in the house or vendors. We don't know if you must have a lot for a vendor or if we can own one or more.

We only saw a tiny bit of the loot system, so how can we earn gold?

I am pretty sure we are not going to see world-wide inventory system, because that will destroy idea of local economies. However, I am quite sure we can have some local inventory space from different towns. Maybe this costs something and/or is behind town progression.

I guess there will be some kind of local marketplace or shop system where to sell and buy goodies. I actually hope, that there would be different kind of market/trading/merchant options which can be unlocked via town progression.

Ingame currency will come into the game most likely by killing humanoid mobs and finding treasures from the open world. I expect not to see animals and creatures to drop nothing more than some resources.