Posts made by Tuoni

I think that consumable slots would work fine. Perhaps start testing with two slots. Consumables to the hotbar can be changed only outside of combat. The use of consumables can balanced quite easily e.g. by adjusting cooldown time.

I do not have a strong opinion on this topic but I would approach this from UX and QoL point of view. I think it is a good thing if you have this possibility to respec during exploration or farming or what ever you are doing and you do not need to interrupt your activities because you need or want to use different build. I am also thinking that why I should care if someone wants to respec somewhere in the wilderness if it makes his / her gaming experience better. If this system can be abused or exploit somehow then I am ready to change my opinion.

@Ulfnaor According to Roadmap, launch is said to happen Winter 2022 so I guess it is planned about one quarter after the Autumn patch. But I agree it is still short time to test things out.

@GamerSeuss said in On the matter of economy (durability, masteries, gear drops, imbuing):

@Tuoni

1. They aren't going to scale back material availability. That is a big part of exploration.
2. This means that if, when you salvage an item, you get even 1 Material back from said item, you've added 1 more material use into the game, thus adding to the Material glut. You would have to scale back materials gathered in the wild and as I said in point 1, they aren't going to do that. (Not likely)
   Right now, a material sink for the game is people making lots of lesser items and then trashing them, just to get mastery. You remove this sink by giving some of the materials back. Or rather, you scale this sink back heavily, as now items get recycled into the system.

Scale back material availabilty... what the heck you are talking about.

Let me tell you how a simplified salvage system works. For example, you get 25% materials back from an item when it is salvaged. If a wooden club requires 4 planks to craft you will get 1 plank back. This is still of course easy because there is an even number of resources, and if we have 100% durability item in question.

However, in advanced system.. Lower durability can affect to the return rate by scaling it down. Additionally, the system can be build so that it takes account items salvaged before (or at the same time) and returns uneven materials later. Or it can use rng (which is easier) with uneven resources, for example, if a staff needs 4 planks and 1 crystal to craft, it will return with that 25% return rate: 1 plank and has a 25% chance to return 1 crystal.

And I want to point out that this was just an example of a salvage system, but it shows how easy it is to implement systems which removes resources and items from the game.

IF there will be deeper progression system in crafting then items could be used / sacrificed as research to progress in a specific crafting path. For example you could get a little bit extra exp in woodrn club path when sacrificing wooden clubs as research.

@GamerSeuss said in On the matter of economy (durability, masteries, gear drops, imbuing):

A salvage system would make matters worse because you would be taking basically almost broken, or essentially useless (skill training) items, and exchanging them out for some of their previously used materials, thus allowing those previously used materials to be used again.

A salvage system essentially means a Material is now worth like 1.1 to 1.5 times as much or more, considering how many times you can use them.

Have you thought that even with the current durability system the result can be scaled based on the durability of the salvaged item? There is not that stupid game designer in the world who would implement such a system which provides more materials than it is worth. Now you have made up your own system where you get always the same amount of materials back regardless of what is the durability of that item at that moment.

@GamerSeuss said in On the matter of economy (durability, masteries, gear drops, imbuing):

@Tuoni Change 'not that interested' to 'the Devs have set a hard line that there will not be a repair function'

A Repair function or Salvage function would just make the economy problems and durability issues 1000x worse off. In fact, even if they adjusted the durability, by adding such functions, you would erase any good you got from those adjustments.

I do agree, as some have said, that more damage needs to be taken by some equipment, like axes and hammers when 'gathering' and maybe a bigger Durability hit when someone is knocked unconscious/dead.

Oh the discussions are now at level semantics, "hard line", christ man...

I did not say there should be a repair system, just pointing out that there is this option to take another path especially if the current system will not work after adjustments.

And please tell me how salvage system would make economy problems 1000x worse? It basically sinks resources and items from the game.

@Ulfnaor said in On the matter of economy (durability, masteries, gear drops, imbuing):

@Tuoni The economy is already extremely problematic because we're having way too much gear and resources coming in and you think we should just... make it worse?

To fix your marketplace-->durability issue, we could simply add the sale of items missing durability to the marketplace and show the durability of the item as you try to buy it.

Why it would be worse? I have said that gear should have less durability. If that is not enough then perhaps devs should take a different approach to the whole system. I have just presented already existing systems which have worked in other games. I am sure that those would work here as well if wanted.

Autumn 2022

"Be prepared, Tartaros brings fear and despair with the fearsome Demons, but you may also expect religion and another expansion of the crafting system! More languages and new tech updates will also be available."

This information gives at least some hopium of better future.

@Ulfnaor said in Master Crafters not Recipe Junkies:

@Tuoni Comparing this current economy with Albion's economy is laughable. First, Albion's crafting system has a multi-tier system of specialization where one not only becomes a master blacksmith but a master plate armor and then a master "chestplate" maker. Our system does not have that. Moreover, Albion's economy benefits from gear destruction. We don't. At most, we have an extremely forgiving durability system.

If you want an economy that works, you need to have at least an equal amount of resources spent vs. resources coming in. We are far, far, far away from that. Not only are we tremendously far away from that point but most of you are arguing for even easier mechanics. No gear break! More durability! We should all be masters of everything!

The current crafting system is a barebones system that you seem to want to defend at all costs. Are "dropped recipes" a good idea? It's a bandaid, an easy-to-implement idea to supplement a very basic system. The fact of the matter is that the current system, outside of enchanting, is really easy to master. You want to talk Albion? Getting to Master in Fractured takes about one hundredth of the resources (comparatively speaking) it takes to go 100/100 for a given weapon/piece of gear on Albion, if not less.

I have not defended the current system (and not sure if anyone has here) so apparently you have not even read the posts. And again with Albion reference you missed the point. I did not compare Albion's system what we currently have here, I used Albion as an example that a specialization system is totally doable even everyone has a possibility to craft everything. Obviously Fractured crafting system is just bare bones and it needs further development. I agree that current recipe system feels like bandaid and something pushed fast into the game so people would have at least something to do, and against that system many here seams to be protesting.

@Clinion I remember as well that devs are not that interested to utilize repair system, however, repair systems are typically a really effective gold sinks, and if some materials would need as well (or as an other option) to the repairing process, it would sink also resources. Perhaps the max durability gets lower everytime gear piece is repaired so that nothing will be everlasting stuff anyway.

In addition, if gear could be sacrificed (research) to progress in crafting and/or gear could be salvaged to get some resources back, those would help to sink gear from the game. Also crafters can then buy some gear from the market and use it to progression purposes, that would enliven the market a bit also.

@spoletta said in Master Crafters not Recipe Junkies:

Yeah agree.

This game is very much "No-alt needed" oriented.

It depends. If the possibility to reroll attributes will be removed for launch, like hinted before that players get one reroll and after that you can do it with real money, then alts are needed to get other classes covered for example. Otherwise alts could be used to play on different planets and/or having a good and evil character separated in Syndesia.

@Ulfnaor said in Master Crafters not Recipe Junkies:

What you are suggesting would only perpetuate a problem that is prevalent in this economy: everyone can do everything.

I know this is the kind of thinking across a lot of modern MMOs and especially themeparks but if everyone is able to craft everything, no one is a specialist. No matter how grindy you make things - and it can get ridiculously grindy - every non-terrible town will have tons of specialists of every profession.

This is not true and Albion is one good example of why. In theory everyone can do freely everything in Albion, however, that is behind a huge timewall. It is much more efficient to specialize yourself because most likely this will be more profitable at the end. In Albion the economy works really well and it is satisfying how easy it is to trade stuff you have gathered, refined or crafted.

Moreover, players are so different and we have completionist who wants to do all the stuff by themselfs, and then we have those who do not want do professions at all. Then we have every possible combination between these two extremes. Therefore, if everyone have in theory a possibility to do everything that does not automatically mean this will happen simply because no interest and/or not enough time to do so.

Economy will not be destroyed even in theory everyone could do everything. This is a matter of design and how the economy in whole is build. I do not want that everyone can do easily everything because that will undermine position of players who wants to focus on crafting for example. Thus, adding some progression systems to professions will help people to specialize.

Even I have said that recipes should be unlock via professions and especially via crafting, I think that some specific recipes could drop from humanoid mobs, which would make perfectly sense.

This was so comprehensive and constructive feedback that it deserves a +1 only because of that, well done. I agree with most of the points and even if I disagree with few I understand the argument and point of view.

At this point I raise only one item because there is so much to discuss with.. Durability. Items are clearly decaying too slowly which will have impact to the economy, therefore, I would like to see some tweaking there. However, making items decay too fast will irritate players especially if resources are hard to get and expensive. This can lead to situation where better gear is less used in action so it will not be destroyed. I like the idea that gear takes extra durability loss upon knockdown or death because this rewards player if he or she plays well. It would be nice if durability loss was balanced better between different gear pieces and not punish e.g. tanks over ranged damage dealers.

@GamerSeuss said in Master Crafters not Recipe Junkies:

@StormBug Could also add a new town building, A Research Center or School/library that you have to go to instead of town hall.

I like this idea because then all researches can be found easily from one building.

I would like to see a research system where resources and crafted products could be used to progress in different crafting paths and unlock crafting recipes. This would also work as a resource and item sink.

@grofire It depends totally which kind of system will be implemented and it does not automatically mean that markets are screwed even progressing in crafting needs actually crafting things. Furthermore, it is not extra grind if the current recipe grind (grinding mobs) is moved to crafting.

I agree that picking up, loading, unloading, storaging, etc. Heavy materials is mainly tedious, time consuming and also unrewarding. On top of that these functions are clunky and primarily only one click is not enough to get things done. Moreover, you do not progress in anyway doing these activies because no KP, or because gathering and refining progession systems aren't available. IF (I am not convinced) developers really think that they need to sink time for these activities then at least make them somehow bareable. For example, let us unload the whole chart inventory with just one click and add a timer so it will take X seconds / item.

@StormBug This is exactly how I feel as well. Professions (crafting in this case) should progress by using activities which are actually related to that specific profession. Like you said we have now a good starting point with the crafting progression system and now it just needs some further development. This is not a problem only with crafting, but all other aspects as well beside combat has no progession. Therefore, professions in general are just side activities which is not a smart solution in sandbox MMORPG where a lot of people are interested these activities as well. For example, every player and character are now master gatherers in any field from day one...

@GamerSeuss said in Player spawn locations during pvp combat is a big issue.:

but the PvPers are in the minority.

Syndesia is not supposed to be balanced between PvP and PvE, it is just supposed to be possible for both, but it is supposed to be 'safer' for PvEers and be a real challenge for PvPers. That has always been the developmental goal as I understand it for Syndesia. It was never meant to be a PvPers playground, or even balanced (which isn't possible) it is just supposed to allow PvP at a steep disadvantage.

This is how I have understood it as well that it has been a design choice from the beginning that PvP can happen in Syndesia but it will be considerably restricted.

Perhaps the final form of PvP rules are still molding, and we have to wait and see where it eventually stops but perhaps this happens after Arboreus and Tartaros are implemented.

At the moment PvP oriented players should adapt to the situation, do not do random PKing if you are not ready to take the penalty. Go for ganking to PvE hotspots where players are farming gold and/or valueable resources. Additionally, reds can always freely kill other reds but it is weird that this is not seen ever as an option. Anyhow, with next expansion there will be Asteroids implemented which are PvP end game content and therefore, planned for all those who are interested such content.

In DnD setting, Liches are mainly evil, however, the lore knows also neutral and even good alignment Liches. Therefore, I do not see that much problems there if players have a chance to make free choise. Angel has been more weird for me because it does not make sense that a demon would ever have a possibility turn to an angel.