problem with that is people will calculate the best damage for pvp (probably burst) and pve (probably sustain) and most players will get the builds for both.
I'd love to have multiple build be great but outside of support I see people playing the best 'tank' and 'damage' abilities.
As I said the devs need to make multiple builds not only "viable" but also necessary. Maybe this is easier to be done (or at least theorised) for pve. You can have a boss for which you will need a burst phase, then you will need high sustained DPS (as you correctly point out). The boss may require, through some mechanics, both melee and range DPS, and voila. Now everyone is needed/required and group leaders will try to find "1 melee burst DPS, 1 melee sustain DPS, 2 range DPS, 2 tanks, 2 healers" or something similar.
At pvp things are more complicated, because pvp is more demandind and fluid. As long as there are more than 2 "meta" builds and these (let's say 5-7) "meta" builds are close to each other and not far ahead from other "Great but not meta" builds then I'd say that the devs will have done a good job at having variety in their game.
And to put things back into prespective, what I am describing is possible, albeit difficult. So, if you/we want to play a game with variety then the devs don't need to make their job even more difficult by adding unnecessary concepts/features (like instanced pvp and/or pve). They want to make an open world, sandbox game, let's allow them to do just that.
If someone wants to play/support/follow a game that will try everything, they can try Ashes of Creation. That said, I have to say that I consider AoC a money grab vaporware for a number of reasons, including the fact that they are promising everything to everyone.
As I have said, so many times, you can't please everyone, you can't do everything. Especially since we are talking about an indie studio here with limited resources.
@phaethonas not to mention DS said they'd have 400 abilities, so they'd have to balance all combinations. or homanzied the damage so that 20 ability's are the 'same damage but GFX is different'.
Good point that I left out for simplicity.
Another way to "balance" classes (or otherwise for classless games) is to make the 400 different abilities, basically 20 abilities.
If you want to have diversity gameplay wise, you will have a hard time balancing the different builds. This is why you end up with "mirror classes" and the like.
People need to understand what the devs are trying to do, and what the devs are trying to do is not easy.
and another will be range and will be useful in situations [Y]. What the devs need to do in that case is for all 4 DPS classes to be useful even necessary in a group. After all it is called MMO for a reason.
@phaethonas with balancing you're making up problems. Balancing will be the same regardless of instancing or not. What difference does it make if the PvE is instanced or not? What difference does it make for PvP? Scale? But they have to balance it for small scale anyway.
Why are you arguing against reality? I already told you; At GW2 instanced pvp and WvW have different "meta" builds, because the gameplay is different.
I think there was mentioned somewhere between the many lines that there will be PvE dungeons for crafting mats. You cannot have PvE dungeon without instancing.
Fractured will not have PvE instanced dungeons. At the very least instanced pve dungeons are not planned at the moment.
It doesn't have anything to do with instances. Single player Open World games are basically whole single instance games
So you wanna tell me that a game that will have instances (as instanced pvp and instanced pve) will be a game in which
a player can roam freely through a virtual world and is given considerable freedom in choosing how or when to approach objectives
I find that hard to believe.
I suppose you may say that they are not mutually exclusive, which I suppose that in theory it is true. In practice though it is impossible to have both.
Fractured's devs want to make an open world, sandbox game, that much is 100% sure and they have said so explicitly. If they add instances (either pve or pvp) it is argued that they will attract more people. Even if we assume that the two crowds/groups are completely seperate, and as such the open world gameplay doesn't affect negatively the population of the instanced gameplay and vice versa, the mechanics, features etc that are employed in each case are different. For example GW2's WvW (although not open world -enough- by many people's definition) is quite different than instanced pvp gameplay wise. As such different builds are considered "meta" for each case.
The problem that rises with that, is similar to a pve vs pvp problem. When a game has both pve and pvp then its classes (or otherwise for classless games) need to be balanced for both. Balancing all classes (or otherwise many/all builds for classless games) is a difficult task on its own, balancing them twice (once per pve and once for pvp) is at least two time difficult (if not more). This brings the whole whinning of one group complaining of "ruining" their class (or otherwise for classless games) because the other group needed the changes. For example; "you ruined my pve monk because the pvp monk was unbalanced". Developers are trying to solve or even circumvent entirely that problem either by introducing a pvp exclusive stat (e.g. expertise at SWTOR) or by having entirely different pvp abilities that share little when compared with the same classes' pve abilities.
So, if you want to cater to everyone and have everything (open world pvp, open world pve, instanced pve, instanced pvp) then you have to balance the ability system four times!!
So, not only will this mean that the devs will have to balance the ability system four times (and we are talking about an indie studio here and not Blizzard), but also the game will lose its identity.
Either your restaurant will have an identity (e.g. Chinese) or you will cater everything and your restaurant will not have an identity. Same goes for pretty much everything and most certainly it is true for MMOs.
Fractured's devs have made themselves clear. They want a game with identity. They are making a niche game. Their game will be open world and sandbox. If they add things; a) they will have made the making of the game many times more difficult, time consuming and expensive, b) the game will lose its intended identity.
My suggestion/advice to them is to stand on their ground and make the niche game they have envisioned. Sure, they will not attract WoW's numbers, not in the slightest. They will have made the game they desire though and I am sure some players will like their game (if they manage to deliver) and their game will be sustainable.
You have your priorities backwards (when compared to Fractured's devs).
I have my wishes but at the same time I have 2 good eyes to see what players likes on MMO (high populated).
And I will tell you for the Nth time, that Fractured's devs don't want to make a game for everyone. They are making a niche game, a sandbox game. So take your advice to someone else, to someone who will want to make games like you are describing.
No, that is not the definition of a niche game.
You have your and I have mine. It's a subjective thing.
No, it is not a subjective thing. Words have objective meaning.
And pvp/pve thing aside, you even want this game to have instances!!
I have never said to add Instance on Tartaros that's the PvP planet. Instance are cool both dungeons and battleground where people can really prove their skill. If you are scared that people could end in Instance instead of open world it's your problem. If a thing like that would happen means that players prefer that than open world. I have never said to remove open world for only instanced things. But giving both option could make everyone happy.
Instanced Dungoens and raids are PvE and players can really focus it.
Instanced Battlegrounds aka arenas/capture the flag and so on are PvP skill based.
Open world Dungeons and Raids are mixed PvE and PvE but in the end is PvP cause you have to fight players so you will focus more on that.
Open world PvP is ganking or spam. For sure I'm looking forward to see the siege mechaninc.
I'm suggesting to add features not to remove. This is a big difference tho.
Once more, these devs want to make an open world game not a game with instances. As such take your advices elsewhere.
And it is neither a matter of where you put these instances (e.g. not at Tartaros) neither if you add features or remove them. An open world, sandbox MMO is the exact opposite of a game with arenas and instanced raids.
So when you are told that "hey I am making an open world MMO that wants to revolutionize the sandbox genre" and your advice is "add instances" then you are not giving constructive feedback.
PS
I am answering only to those subjects where you "pushed my buttons", especially since you said that words have a subjective meaning! lol
Still I can't see these "fur, hides. carapaces" etc replacing the unique materials Arboreus (or even Syndesia) will have.
The devs have stated before materials won't be strictly better or worse, just different. Who cares that your bow is made from Tartaros bone instead of Arboreus wood when the stats are the same. If anything, the fact that every planet has its own resources makes the economy in Fractured work. If all planets had the same resources, then yes Arboreus would be the easiest place to get those resources. But since Tartaros has its own resources, they will have something unique to offer on the market that the PvE planet doesn't have.
Sure, if each each planet's economy is self-sustainable then you will be correct. If my bow is made of "Bone tier 7" which is as strong as "Steel", then, yes there will be no problem.
The problem arises with your assumption that this will be the case.
Although it is not clear at the moment (and it should be clarified, @Prometheus) it is implied that each planet's economy won't be self-sustainable. If each planet's economy was/will be self-sustainable then there is no incentive to move between the planets, a key concept of the game. As travelling between planets is a key concept of the game, it can be assumed that each planet's economy won't be self sustainable.
I have been telling you for quite some time, and I don't mean that as an insult, I mean that as a friendly suggestion; You are following the wrong game.
Considering how hard you're trying to change Fractured, have you ever considered you might be the one following the wrong game? You're telling people "This is how Fractured should be, and because you don't like it, you should leave". You're literally telling people to stop following Fractured because they don't agree with your suggestions, even though your suggestions are just that, suggestions.
will have or will not have what they are looking for. I am doing that here, I am doing that at Reddit, I am doing that in other places as well.
If for example someone asks me; "I want to play arenas/instances pvp, is Fractured good for me?" What do you want me to say? Yes?! Fractured won't have instances! Not even pve instances!
And I told you so many times that with; a) a ton of debuffs on me, b) the "wildlife"/NPCs hunting me and c) the 30 minute restriction, it is impossible for me to go from point A (spawn point) to point B (where I will gather mats), especially since.....I don't know where point B is! Assuming that after 7 times that I tried to go to Arboreus, I finally found where point B is, I will still have to a) go from point A to point B (which may take 10 minutes of "walking"), b) all the while fight the "wildlife"/NPCs that will be attacking me, c) have a ton of debuffs on me and then finally, actually harvesting, and all that in under 30 minutes!
It sounds to me that you know things about Fractured's gathering system that we don't know. Care to share?
What do you mean? I am describing what is already known.
Debuffs, Arboreus wildlife attacking "evil" players, 30 minute restrictions are confirmed at this spotlight.
Prometheus confirmed that Arboreus will be Terra Incognita for the other races, including Demons. He also confirmed that initially you will be spawning at pre-determined spawn points. Other spawn points will be becoming available as you reveal them.
It makes sense that these predetermined spawn points won't be inside a forest at which you will be gathering wood. They will be 3 km away, towards the East. As you will be spawning at an unknown area, you have 25% chance of going at the correct direction. So, it is possible that you may be getting further away from the forest, instead of closer, cause you are heading towards the West! In 30 minutes time, assuming that you are still alive, you will be 6 km away from the forest/wood gathering area. As such, you are sent back to Tartaros and then you make preparations to go back at Arboreus. This time you head....North. Well that was a mistake as well. Even if you head East (towards the forest), you may need 40 minutes to walk the distance of 3 km, or you may need just 10 minutes (per se/walking), but as the wildlife is attacking you and you are forced to fight your way through, you will need 40 minutes. Oops, still you didn't reach your target destination. Even if you make it to the forest in 25 minutes, you will only have 5 minutes of grinding wood.
Bottom line is that all these restrictions, combined, are creating a great problem.
There is a key point here; This will be a problem assuming that each planet's economy is not self sustainable. If you are correct and each planet's economy is self sustainable, then there will be no problem.
As I have said before;
The solutions are three;
remove pvp altogether and make the game only for care bears
at one planet, plentiful at another) and make all planets equal/same.
3) remove the restrictions at Arboreus, or rather loosen them. Yes, this will drive the care bears away, but as I have said before, not all pvers are care bears.
That said, I don't think it makes much sense to have three self sustainable economies and a mechanic of travelling. I don't see the point on that.
PS
#2 is about what I am calling in this comment as "self sustainable economy"
Will it be possible to trade in-game Fractured's cosmetic items or not?
As of today, the plan is that it won't be possible. When you buy a skin for a race or for some type of armor or for a kind of pet, it just adds the option in your account to use the skin (it will reskin that type of item if you're wearing it, or that type of pet if you're controlling it). Same goes for cosmetic pets. None are actual in-game items, and there is no auction house where you can sell the skins etc that you own to other players.
if demons or bad humans come to invade my planet, certainly they will have to do to my planet, to its wild fauna (maybe to its flora too ^ ^) but surely to me too and I would not be the only one to play like that.
I would pay for that (flora NPCs attacking demon(s)). Please make it so.
You still are arguing at changing Fractured while you keep claiming that you don't! Is it so hard for you to understand that Fractured's devs want to make a niche game?!
I'm just givin my point of view (feedback). I'm allowed to do it. I have not powers to change things.
Sure, but think about it. It is one thing to give your feedback within the lines of a specific project (in this case an MMO) and it is entirely different to say; "You project sucks, make something else which will be entirely different". Which is what you are doing.
devs want
Hard words, I really think that Devs (if they can) would love to make a game more popular as possible. It's everyone's dream to succeed. They are only flying at half height.. luckly. But who knows for the future. The game could please many and soar, consequently be successful. In an early stage LoL was a niche game but look at that now (just an example)
No, the devs want to make a game with identity. Sure, they want it to be successful and they want it to be played by many people, but primarily, they want to make a game with identity and not a GW2 clone.
You have your priorities backwards (when compared to Fractured's devs).
The whole key concept of three different planets, with three different races, with three different "rulesets", with three different economies is niche!
You are thinking it. A niche game is when it is not very appetizing and there are not many players for that reason. 99% of the times due the Killing Spree/Griefing/Mad Community.
No, that is not the definition of a niche game.
I have been telling you for quite some time, and I don't mean that as an insult, I mean that as a friendly suggestion; You are following the wrong game.
I don't think. Have you ever stopped to think a second that maybe that's you? Quoting @Vengu "Considering how hard you're trying to change Fractured, have you ever considered you might be the one following the wrong game? You're telling people "This is how Fractured should be, and because you don't like it, you should leave". You're literally telling people to stop following Fractured because they don't agree with your suggestions, even though your suggestions are just that, suggestions."
He's right. That (your) is not a good way to let the community grow (Only because someone got a different point of view)! More players/users = more ideas/suggestions/feedbacks = better game (in most cases). More players/users would also help Devs about finances and could guarantee if not simply give more longevity to the game. I have seen too many games explode due to lack of players with the consequent lack of enough income.
If it was me, I would have wanted and I would have expressed an interest to change the game, I don't want to change the game. You have expressed your disagreement with many and key concepts of the game. And pvp/pve thing aside, you even want this game to have instances!!
Fractured is not the game you like, this is why you want it to be something entirely different. Fractured won't be like GW2, ESO, WoW and other games you have said that are "successful" and whose path you want Fractured to follow. Fractured's devs are thinking out of this box and this was clear from day 1.
Really? You have no clue about what I like. I hope that Fractured will not be like GW2 (I really don't like GW2). You are failing hard due Devs said form day 1 that Fractured will be a game for both PvPers and PvErs. I'm only giving a good feedback to make it good/funny/enjoyable for my fellows PvErs.
How am I failing hard, because the devs want the game to be for both PvPers and PvErs? You think that I want a pvp game and I came here?
Why would I do that when there are a couple of pure pvp games in the making? As a matter of fact I have already said that came here to pve and not to pvp, because I intend to pvp at Camelot Unchained, which is a pure pvp game.
And I will repeat once more, that according to you, games like WoW, GW2, ESO are successful and that Fractured's devs should go down that route. Niche games are a failure according to you. You have suggested instances because they will attract more people, when the devs don't want instances and they want to revolutionize the sandbox (a niche) MMO genre.
You couldn't have expressed more clearly how much you disagree with what the devs want.
are not what I want (e.g. it will have p2w) I lose interest on the game and move with my life.
I have never said that Fractured should be a purely pvp game, as a matter of fact I have numerous times have said the opposite and I have given feedback accordingly. You on the other hand, want a different game. And you disagree with key concepts of Fractured on more things than one.
So you want to help? Do so within the lines of the game the devs want to make.
You are not the one to tell me what to say or what to do. I give my feedback/suggestion and Devs are smart enough to take their own decisions. Neither me or you have any kind of power here.
Sure, you wanna be the guy who says; "your project sucks, no-one plays sandbox games, make a theme-park" or "your project sucks, no-one likes open world games, you must have instances". OK, be that guy. I won't have a problem with that.
And I told you so many times that with; a) a ton of debuffs on me, b) the "wildlife"/NPCs hunting me and c) the 30 minute restriction, it is impossible for me to go from point A (spawn point) to point B (where I will gather mats), especially since.....I don't know where point B is! Assuming that after 7 times that I tried to go to Arboreus, I finally found where point B is, I will still have to a) go from point A to point B (which may take 10 minutes of "walking"), b) all the while fight the "wildlife"/NPCs that will be attacking me, c) have a ton of debuffs on me and then finally, actually harvesting, and all that in under 30 minutes!
can already see ways for my demon horde to bring death and destruction at Arboreus. Sure it will require some real planning and team work, but that challenge is very much welcome
For example;
I have some members of my guild to achieve neutral alignment (neutral demons have been confirmed). Then I send those ahead of the rest of us. They go and put themselves into key positions of the planet and then....
Evil aligned demons enter Arboreus and start killing and destroying. Sure after 30 minutes those will be kicked out but then.....
the second wave of evil demons will enter and then the third and the fourth and the fifth, all the while group 1 of the neutral demons will turn "aggresive", then group 2, then group 3.
Let's assume that I was in the first wave. Depending how easy and "fast" it is to go to Arboreus and whether I will have a debuff or not, I may return.
Depending the size of my guild or even the alliance of guilds that I am at, demons may have Arboreus at constant siege.
Yes, it requires planning and co-ordination, yes, I won't be there but for a measly 30 minutes, but my presence will be felt for days.
To put it simply; I am willing to bet that the aforementioned strong deterrents will create large and strong demon alliances with sole purpose of bypassing these deterrents. We PvPers will enjoy to play the cat and mouse game with the devs, finding legal ways to make our presence felt.
And now enter evil humans. I will contact large evil human alliances/guild and we will schedule attacks at Arboreus. 01:00 - 04:00 AM I will be sending 8 waves of demons. 04:00 - 08:00 AM the humans will be invading. And thus it is clear that Arboreus is far from safe.
Even if we will have a debuff for 30 days that will not allow us to travel to Arboreus, all "evil" players will band together once per month in order to bring chaos to Arboreus for hours, maybe even days, depending how many "evil" demons and humans are in this "unholy alliance". And be absolutely certain, this "unholy alliance" has just been made, regardless if I play the game or not.
If indeed your goal is to make Arboreus safe, you have only one way to go. Don't allow travel to it for evil and even neutral aligned characters. That of course should be accompanied with Arboreus not having unique resources, in order not to imbalance the economy.
All things considered though (that you want each planet to have unique resources, that you want Arboreus rather safe etc) I'd suggest lowering the deterrents towards the individual player. The more you are trying to stop the individual player to go, explore, Krash Kill N' Destroy, the more these individuals will want to do so and they will try to circumvent your deterrent systems by banding together.
You know what will stop demons from entering Arboreus and wreaking havoc? In-fighting. As long as you won't give the players who want to play in a FFA environment a reason to band together, they won't, and as such they won't be able to do much harm, cause most of the action will be at Tartaros. If you incentivise us to band together, then you will have the opposite effect.
Yes, and how am I contradicting myself?
In the first case I was talking about myself. I won't be able to go by myself to gather mats at Arboreus for the reasons I explained. This will lead me to try to circumvent that problem by teaming up, which I explained how it will be done in what you quoted.
So bottom line;
In the context of the three planets with three different economies, demons will want/need to go to Arboreus.
Demon alone at Arboreus? Can't be done.
Demons will team up and will circumvent the restrictions we so far know (and work at the individual level). If more restriction are applied (at the group level), Tartaros will just be empty and the game will have failed.
You need balance. You need compromises.
You look so confident when we do not actually have the game to test yet.
Have you ever played an MMORPG before? Cause if you describe the above to someone who has, he/she will tell you that this is impossible to be done.
I did but prolly different games. I playes as Raid hardcore player on WoW since 2004 to 2014 that just to point out something. To call another game Albion Online. I don't wanna provide list/screenie/acheivements of all games I played.
No please don't. It is clear now why you want Fractured to be something else.
Behind the "You can just travel to gather tho" has a context which you are not taking into consideration.
Funny that you said that. You should explain that context you are talking about.
I already have. In detail, and it flew way over your head!
PS
I won't even bother with you anymore. Reply if you want, I won't. It is clear now that you neither are paying attention to what is being told to you and that you not only dislike but maybe even hate key concepts of Fractured (e.g. open world, sandbox and balance of pvp/pve).
You want to support financially Fractured when KS starts? OK, so much better for the game and so much worse for you. The game will get its money and you won't get the game you want.
My only hope/wish is for the devs not to listen to you, and anyone else like you for that matter, that clearly and explicitly have expressed their dislike for key concepts they (the devs) are trying to push.
That was before read the last spotlight. And when I said I want to change was something more like I want let them avoid to fail. I'm giving good feedback to make a longevity game with a good population. Niche games with your wishes are a good way to kill a game. The is not out we have years to test it and give feedback. I think that we can try to have bot kind of payers playign togeter with the right restrinctions.
You still are arguing at changing Fractured while you keep claiming that you don't! Is it so hard for you to understand that Fractured's devs want to make a niche game?!
They outright say that they want to do things others haven't tried as well as things that others have tried and have failed at doing. The whole key concept of three different planets, with three different races, with three different "rulesets", with three different economies is niche!
I have been telling you for quite some time, and I don't mean that as an insult, I mean that as a friendly suggestion; You are following the wrong game.
Fractured is not the game you like, this is why you want it to be something entirely different. Fractured won't be like GW2, ESO, WoW and other games you have said that are "successful" and whose path you want Fractured to follow. Fractured's devs are thinking out of this box and this was clear from day 1.
So you want to help? Do so within the lines of the game the devs want to make. You are suggesting to them to make a GW2 clone basically. They don't want to make a GW2 clone!
I have never said to remove that needs. You can just travel to gather tho. You are missing the fact that the main purpose is that an not going to arboreus just to kill beasts. Like the purpose to play on Syndesia is the siege. Tartaros is the killing spree.
And I told you so many times that with; a) a ton of debuffs on me, b) the "wildlife"/NPCs hunting me and c) the 30 minute restriction, it is impossible for me to go from point A (spawn point) to point B (where I will gather mats), especially since.....I don't know where point B is! Assuming that after 7 times that I tried to go to Arboreus, I finally found where point B is, I will still have to a) go from point A to point B (which may take 10 minutes of "walking"), b) all the while fight the "wildlife"/NPCs that will be attacking me, c) have a ton of debuffs on me and then finally, actually harvesting, and all that in under 30 minutes!
Have you ever played an MMORPG before? Cause if you describe the above to someone who has, he/she will tell you that this is impossible to be done.
tl;dr Behind the "You can just travel to gather tho" has a context which you are not taking into consideration.
Big bosses that drop rare materials not found at Tartaros otherwise.....the same Tartaros that is an FFA pvp planet? Doubtful
Quoted again from the main site:
Not all resources are fine with being harvested. Fur, hides, bones, carapaces and several other key crafting components can only be obtained through PVE combat. If you’re an avid monster hunter, Tartaros will be your dreamland… or perhaps your worst nightmare.
In my opinion open world PvP is best when you're fighting for something; over a grind spot, to secure a boss kill, over a rare resource, etc. Tartaros can't just be a big pvp arena, there has to be something to do there that isn't hunting other players and sieges. Something to complement the PvP. It's a combat oriented planet and I'm hoping it will have the most rewarding combat oriented resource gathering.
Still I can't see these "fur, hides. carapaces" etc replacing the unique materials Arboreus (or even Syndesia) will have.
First of all I find the 30 minutes restriction too much. More importantly though, here are some questions; OK after 30 minutes I am kicked out, how long till I am able to return? Do I have a debuff not allowing me to return, or I may start preparations returning immediately. When first going to Arboreus, where do I land? When I am kicked out and then return (whether this is after 1 hour or 24 hours) where do I return to? Will I return to the area I was kicked out from?
You're always able to return. There are some default landing points, others you can learn to open, but you can't just go anywhere you like - just a brief explanation here. As for the others things you've said, remember that we can always adjust the type, duration and intensity of maluses / limitations to have things working as planned - that hostile PvP on Arboreus is an exceptional occurrence, not the norm. This will all be defined during Alpha testing!
Also good to know.
That said have in mind that many aspects of the economy ("working economy" if you like) won't be clear till players are actually playing the game, with all features/mechanics in play, and start harvesting, crafting, trading, looting etc.
So, even if during Alpha you won't be seeing any of the problems I mentioned, don't think you won't be seeing them when the game will go live. As a matter of fact I would say you will encounter these problems after a few weeks, post launch. So either consider "learning" from other games or having an extensive pre-launch beta. Like an open/free promotional beta for 1 month before release, then wipe everything (if all goes well and no changes are needed) and launch the game. Or something on that line, anyhow.
The important thing is for you to have understood that if you go too harsh on the demons aka FFA pvpers, that would hurt the game.
As I have said so many times, we can't have everything in this life, we can't please everyone, we must make compromises. You can't attract care-bears as well as "gankers" as these two groups want the exact opposite things. As a matter of fact you can't attract either as long as you want both pvpers and pvers. If you have gankers, you won't be able to please non care-bear pvers and if you have care-bear pvers you won't be able to please pvpers who won't mind not "ganking" (non gankers pvpers).
In order for Fractured to work at the very least the following are needed;
Pvpers to accept that restrictions at pvp will be placed. Each planet will have different set of pvp restrictions.
Pvers to accept that sometimes they may be killed. Depending where (which planet) they are, these "sometimes" will be "more" or "less" and will be within a different context. But they have to accept that nowhere they will be 100% safe, not even close to 90%, although these numbers are completely arbitrary.
And finally, you (the devs) to understand that you can't please everyone and all the times. We (the MMO players) want games with identity and not games that will try everything. Games that will try to be both sandbox and themepark, both open world and instanced, etc. Having to reconcile pvp and pve in a functional way is hard enough and there are significant chances that you will fail. If you want to have better chances, you have to draw a line on the sand. And the sooner, the better.
Is it so hard for you to understand this? It is simple actually.
I want the exact opposite of what you want and you want the exact opposite of what I want.
As I have said before, everyone, the devs, the pvpers, the pvers, everyone, literally everyone, must make some compromises. But that doesn't work for everyone and everything, and all the times.
There are pvers that won't compromise, and they are called care bears. There are pvpers who won't compromise and are called "gankers". Fractured isn't a game for gankers as much as it isn't a game for care bears. Because to put it simply, Fractured wants to find the right solution and cater to both pvpers and pvers. To do so, compromises are needed. For both pvpers and pvers.
The only way to cater for both care bears and gankers, is if you remove a key concept of the game. The need for traveling between the three planets, aka remove the unique economic element of each planet.
But the devs clearly don't want that, they are building their game around that concept.
So, they have to compromise, make a stand and say; "Fractured is not for you care bears" and then add; "Fractured is not for you either gankers".
As long as they try to cater to everyone, they will fail. I have been saying this from day 1.
@phaethonas talents/abilities are not related to the gear like Albion this means you can fight naked. Good point to avoid grinding in a game where you can lose things. If the game will be unbalanced somehow well give the right feedback
The game is getting unbalanced and I am giving the right feedback, as proven by the support I am getting. You just don't agree with that. But yeah, we know who you are. You disagree with a lot of things about Fractured and you want it to be another game. You have outright and explicitly said so.
I have more players to my side than what you think and I'm not changin Fractured. I just wanna bring the balance. You can ask @Prometheus if you want. I'm givin my feedback and a game for gankers is not the design of fractured or at least not Arboreus and Syndesia. Accept it and stop arguing or go somewhere else I think most of players are getting bored to read this. You are only thinking to your playstyle without care about the others.
I have no idea how many support your ideas but I am 100% sure that you want to outright change core things about Fractured.
As for "gankers", I have said many times that Fractured can't be a game for care bears. Some things are impossible. So, having a game with PvP, care bears and three different planets with different economies is impossible. It is not a matter of "playstyle" anymore. This is what you fail to understand. You have to remove at least one of the three aforementioned elements in order to succeed.
Currently, Fractured will fail because the economy will either lead Tartaros at being empty or the demons will band together and ravage Arboreus, which then will make the care bears cry.
The solutions are three;
remove pvp altogether and make the game only for care bears
at one planet, plentiful at another) and make all planets equal/same.
remove the restrictions at Arboreus, or rather loosen them. Yes, this will drive the care bears away, but as I have said before, not all pvers are care bears.
Anything else, will ultimately fail, one way or another.
You may not care, because you clearly haven't been sold on the concept of Fractured (which you want to change), but some of us like some of the concepts of Fractured and we would like to play this game. Not another game, not a "changed" game, THIS game.
@phaethonas talents/abilities are not related to the gear like Albion this means you can fight naked. Good point to avoid grinding in a game where you can lose things. If the game will be unbalanced somehow well give the right feedback
The game is getting unbalanced and I am giving the right feedback, as proven by the support I am getting. You just don't agree with that. But yeah, we know who you are. You disagree with a lot of things about Fractured and you want it to be another game. You have outright and explicitly said so.
@phaethonas I don't care about economy, I just care to kill stuff for example.
The irony of that comment is over 9000!
I, the "ganker", "the pvper who wants to ruin everyone game", care about the economy (and as such the game's success) and the defender of the care bears (Finland) cares only for killing stuff!!
Oh the irony! I adore irony.
Killing mobs = killing stuff. I have never said I dislike killing players. I enjoy arenas and battlegrounds. I mostly play moba and fps but I hate people like *** going to kill carebears.
This game is not for care-bears and it should not be for cear bears. If the devs try to cater to the care bears they will either fail or ultimately deliver something entirely different than what they wanted to make; An open world MMO, with three different planets, that will have different economies.
@phaethonas Your quote seems to imply that most passive resource gathering on Tartaros is rare, and I wasn't disagreeing with that. What I'm hoping Tartaros will be rich for are big boss-like creatures that drop rare materials. Things that require a lot more effort and a lot more risk than just setting up a farm on Arboreus. But I'm just speculating, we'll have to see how it turns out.
Big bosses that drop rare materials not found at Tartaros otherwise.....the same Tartaros that is an FFA pvp planet? Doubtful
Now, the solution is simple; Make cosmetics bind on pickup.
lol if thy do that all cosmetic things bougth via shop should not be lootable. I still don't care about RMT I alway find lots of people buying accounts to get more money. You will never solve that problem.
Why would the cosmetics be lootable?
Why not? In Albion cosmetic items are lootable for example.
For one simple reason; The game becomes p2w. And Albion is not a game anyone wants to copy.
