Why will the control be based on a mouse?
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I would like to ask why you decided to make control based on a mouse and not a keyboard?
I know a few MMOs that are based on mouse control and all of them with small online because of the fact that people want more freedom of action and opportunities, rather than nervous control of the mouse to evade the ability.PS I'm not criticizing your position - I can understand that for a game based on the keyboard will have to spend more resources. Or you have more grandiose plans:thinking:
I'm sorry for not literacy, I use an interpreter:flag_ru:
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Hi @33Hp! Fractured uses a top-down camera that doesn't rotate - if you've played games like Diablo, Path of Exile, Torchlight, you will know what I mean. With this type of camera, keyboard controls don't make much sense. You use your left hand to cast spells clicking buttons on the keyboard and your right hand to hold the mouse (moving and using basic attacks). It's pretty much the industry standard!
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Awsome love Diablo been stuck on it for a montg or so now. Definetly digging the control design you are going with.
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Yeah that control scheme is definitely pretty standards for the isometric/top down camera
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@Prometheus said in Why will the control be based on a mouse?:
Hi @33Hp! Fractured uses a top-down camera that doesn't rotate - if you've played games like Diablo, Path of Exile, Torchlight, you will know what I mean. With this type of camera, keyboard controls don't make much sense. You use your left hand to cast spells clicking buttons on the keyboard and your right hand to hold the mouse (moving and using basic attacks). It's pretty much the industry standard!
Please WASD to move and mouse to aim, i'm sick of point and click MMO, enough is enough, it is boring and slow as f#ck
Look at Realm of the Mad god or Tree of Savior, WASD + Mouse AIM is the way to go, please experiment it
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To be honest the last few years I only play MMOs with action combat usually played with wsad movement and mouse aiming. The tense it brings with it is unmatched.
On the other hand since LR I miss the right click to move feature. When I played with it it was very responsive and relaxing and the combat still seemed tense enough.
So I d support a heavy action combat system, which suits better a skill based combat game, but right click to move gives an old school touch, and will make it more relaxing and easier to play (cause you can fire spells on the go with only one hand while moving with the other)
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Developers look management in the "MMO Revelation" borrow from them the ability to change management from WASD to mouse.
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There are plenty of games with
- Fluid movement (IE: not grid based)
- More than 10 keybinds that require decent reaction time
- No camera control
- No turning arc/turning animation/turn delay
- Both keyboard and mouse movement options
Talk to any competitive, or even just "no bad" player from any of these games and they'll tell you keyboard should never be used for movement, excluding maybe autorun. Keyboard turning in a meme I'm sure anybody who's played an MMO with even 2-3 of the above qualities has heard.
From the screenshot I assume Fractured is intended to have fluid movement, meaning some high mathy number of directions you can move based on pixel numbers. If you use keyboard movement, the highest number of directions you can move in is 8 if there's no camera control.
The genre Prom has most compared Fractured to has been MOBAs. I'd point out there are LEGAL WASD/ESDF movement mods for DoTA and LOL. Neither of which are used by anybody who's anybody because they're straight up garbage.
There's honestly an argument to be made that even if it were incredibly cheap/simple/whatever to add a keyboard movement option to a PVP game it shouldn't be done for the same reason some MMOs don't allow you to click abilities. It's a noob trap. If you get used to it, and you're bad, you probably won't realize how much better mouse movement is.
Learning to do things the wrong way typically puts you in a worse position than having not learned at all.With all that in mind, hey @Prometheus you should add keyboard movement so I can make fun of people for keyboard turning. Literally running circles around keyboard turners in WoW when you're like 10% slower than them is always hilarious.
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@Holya There's some truth to all that, but there's also problems with how some games do mouse controls. Nothing frustrated me more with the original DOTA than having to constantly click to keep in place, so that I didn't watch the character do stupid things. Soured me on the idea of MOBAs for quite a while, to be honest. It felt like I was a baby-sitter instead of a badass.
So long as they avoid that trap, with auto-attack, the rest are fairly forgivable.
And yes, turn speed is huge in 3d gaming. Talk to anybody who is decent at FPS games and they will note they use a high setting on turn speed. Once you are adjusted to controlling that, anything else feels slow... and you do indeed run circles around people (or win because you get on target quicker.)
That said, I've actually seen some valid uses of keyboard turning in some MMOs, where being able to interact with something on screen during a specific encounter is far more important than turn speed or exacting turn control. Very rare though, although it was always funny to watch those who refused to do it fail.
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@Holya try Realm of the Mad God, perfect gameplay for WASD for movement + mouse for aiming
If they come to make yet another click to move game, then i'll pass, there are already ton of them
If they go WASD + Aiming, then it'll pick my interest
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@scellow as pointed out above, the games you mentioned, including ROTMG, have 8-direction movement. That's really the only type of movement possible with WASD in a top-down game, but for us, it would be way too limiting. Even if we implemented WASD to please a few players, we would just put those players at a disadvantage compared to those using click-to-move.
That being said, I think that you lack of appreciation for click-to-move might be due to the fact you associate it with pathfinding, auto-follow and auto-attack. This will not be the case for Fractured: pathfinding exists, but it's limited (on purpose), most of the time you will hold down the mouse button to move because you'll be busy dodging and positioning. Auto-attacking and auto-follow don't exist at all.
Rest assure, combat will be both tactical and hectic, you will love it "even" with click-to-move!
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Works best for this kind of games
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How easy will it be to actively move in direction opposite or sideways to attack direction? With WASD + mouse it's easy and nice. With all mouse controlled I've played it's hard at best. Most mouse controlled games deal with it in a way that they dumb down combat so it's charging at enemies while firing skills. From what I've read about the game it's aspiring to be more then that. Or am I wrong?
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@tulukaruk said in Why will the control be based on a mouse?:
How easy will it be to actively move in direction opposite or sideways to attack direction? With WASD + mouse it's easy and nice. With all mouse controlled I've played it's hard at best. Most mouse controlled games deal with it in a way that they dumb down combat so it's charging at enemies while firing skills. From what I've read about the game it's aspiring to be more then that. Or am I wrong?
Hi tulukaruk! I don't get your point about being hard to move in a direction opposite / sideways to the attack direction. When you click on a point on the ground (or hold down the mouse) to move, your character faces the direction of the movement. Since turning is almost instantaneous, you can easily repeat dodge-attack sequences. Actually, you'll be moving (dodging, retreating) all the time when you fight - going in like a bull against your target will generally be a very a bad idea!
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@Prometheus said in Why will the control be based on a mouse?:
Hi tulukaruk! I don't get your point about being hard to move in a direction opposite / sideways to the attack direction. When you click on a point on the ground (or hold down the mouse) to move, your character faces the direction of the movement. Since turning is almost instantaneous, you can easily repeat dodge-attack sequences. Actually, you'll be moving (dodging, retreating) all the time when you fight - going in like a bull against your target will generally be a very a bad idea!
Is there going to be target lock? Cause as you wrote the mouse will be most of the time away from out target.
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Finally I won't fail due to the auto-follow as I sometimes do in LOL
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@tulukaruk said in Why will the control be based on a mouse?:
Is there going to be target lock? Cause as you wrote the mouse will be most of the time away from out target.
No target lock, no auto-follow. All spells and attacks are skill-shots
It's up to you to time your movements and the cooldowns of your spells - the limited number of spells you can carry with you at the same time, that is.
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@Prometheus said in Why will the control be based on a mouse?:
No target lock, no auto-follow. All spells and attacks are skill-shots
It's up to you to time your movements and the cooldowns of your spells - the limited number of spells you can carry with you at the same time, that is.Then I really fail to see how mouse movement will be superior to WASD movement. Maybe I'm not good enough but I cannot use that 22.5 degrees more precise movement in combat.
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@tulukaruk said in Why will the control be based on a mouse?:
Then I really fail to see how mouse movement will be superior to WASD movement. Maybe I'm not good enough but I cannot use that 22.5 degrees more precise movement in combat.
Well, of course the fact you can move in unlimited direction helps you compared to someone who is limited to 8 directions. That doesn't apply to combat only, just to plain walking around in a world which is not tile-based and is rich with "solid" objects (objects you can collide with) of many different sizes. Such is the world of Fractured, which cannot be "empty" like the maps of some of the games mentioned above because of how interactable our environment is and how you can use such interactions to help you in combat
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@Prometheus said in Why will the control be based on a mouse?:
Well, of course the fact you can move in unlimited direction helps you compared to someone who is limited to 8 directions.
Sorry but I fail to see how. It is certainly nice. And looks way better then 8 directions movement. But I don't see how it would help.
And I don't see how WASD movement has anything to do with grid. It doesn't.
Don't get me wrong - I'm hoping for great game - I'm not writing it to just argue
