In Communicado


    One of the great problems with online games, particularly games that have strangers engaging in PvP, is lack of accurate communication.
    In real life you can (usually) tell when someone is joking, or show that you are joking; body language, tone of voice etc. but in a game it is not so easy.
    It's one thing to just attack another player on sight, but what you might view as a legitimate provocation might be taken as simple brutality, and ruin the game for that player.
    It is often hard to tell what exactly is intended; do they want a friendly duel? are you trespassing? and so on, particularly when lag comes into play.

    To use an example of a different game with challenging combat communication problem: Dark Souls.
    Dark Souls has four communication systems:
    1: Messages allow a player to give general information, but is too slow and too vague to be used in combat
    2: Carvings allow a player to 'speak' one or two words, which, if skilfully used can be quite versatile, but a player will only have them equipped if they are currently focusing on PvP.
    3: Gestures are a brilliant means of combat communication between players, though they can be cumbersome to select.
    4: Action. Dark Souls is a third person game which makes it remarkably easy to show by your characters movements how you are thinking and what you intend: Are you a noble duelist? are you willing to back off and give them a breather? are you taking every advantage you can get? are you just a jerk? etc.

    While I do not suggest any of the communication systems used in Dark Souls be integrated, or even think it would be possible, I would be very happy if someone could think of a more ergonomic way to determine or express exactly how you/they view PvP, because while Fractured does have an available chat, it is almost impossible to use while in combat.

    Another related point; while I initially thought that combat in Fractured was simply a matter of activating skills and hoping you win, I was pleasantly surprised, once I figured it out, how much strategy you can apply to the game, beyond just having particular attack and defence types against certain enemies, you can use different skills to compliment others, or interfere with your opponents skills, etc.

    However, I do feel that the fast pace of the combat, particularly PvP, is at best difficult for beginners.

  • Moderator

    Contrarily to Dark Souls where someone can attack you out of nowhere, here you have to flag red. You already know if the other one is hostile.

  • TF#10 - CONSUL

    Dark Souls is a third person game which makes it remarkably easy to show by your characters movements how you are thinking and what you intend:

    This isn't true at all. Dark souls gave you so many tools to deceive others. Such as a ring that made your phantom white instead of red, so they thought you were friendly. Invisible spells or a ring that masked your visibility from a distance. There was an item I loved in Dark Souls 3 that transformed you into an object in the environment. And heck, there are many times where as a purple phantom I would earn the trust of the host, and then betray them with a satisfying kick down a cliff or backstab. I loved all of that. You never know what a stranger is going to do, which always keeps a feeling of suspense. Being 'relaxed' in a PvP game is synonymous with being bored. Could you imagine playing an RPG where you know beforehand who you can trust and who will betray you? That spoils the game.


    Oh yes in real life it's so easy to know someone's a hostile person when there name isn't painted red above there heads. Even when some of the most brutal serial killer look and act like a normal person.

    Anyone else getting the "Notice me senpai, notice me!" vibe from this guy and his forum posts? You do know this is a full loot PvP game right? No ones going to initiate a fight with a warning or yell "I'm going to attack you now!" in local chat. If someone wanted to duel they'll type in chat or maybe do a couple spins for friendliness. But if someone is coming towards you and gets within range it's your fault for just standing there with your thumb up your ass. Especially when that player has their name in a bright red color.


    @Mirgannel12 said in In Communicado:

    It's one thing to just attack another player on sight, but what you might view as a legitimate provocation might be taken as simple brutality, and ruin the game for that player.

    First of all, let me make clear that I am not interested in PvP and will be playing on Arboreus. But even there will be zones where there is a change people from an invasion will try to kill you. By entering those zones you have to be aware that players you meet will be hostile and act accordingly.

    Syndesia will be ofcourse a mix of both PvE and PvP but even there you should be aware of "red" people.

    Beside the statement "You do know this is a full loot PvP game right?" which isn't entirly true. @darwinjay has a point.

    Expecting gentlemen behaviour, where players will ask you 3 times if you will want to be killed is not very realistic 🙄

    So if you are playing in the alpha where there is only syndesia available, i'm afraid you have to deal with "as is"


    @spoletta Is there a way to tell if someone is hostile? I thought the red name was just evil alignment...


    @Hathos true, dark souls does have many ways to deceive, though if you play the game enough the chameleon spell doesn't work on you, you know where everything is, I found an invader that way once, he didnt realise he invaded someone who knew where every vase and lectern was supposed to be 😛 (I didn't realise the untrue white ring worked if you were already a phantom, I thought it only worked if you were the host, so that invaders didn't prioritise you 😛 actually, that doesn't really make sense, why would anyone be fooled by a red phantom pretending to be white? you would hope the host would remember they didn't summon that person/ there is a big flashing sign that says you just got invaded... unless there is lag)
    As to betraying hosts, well then, you are exactly the type of player I had in mind when I wrote this.

    A feeling of suspense is all well and good, when you are playing PvP and are near a bonfire, but when you're in a hard place to retrieve your souls, it's nice to know who your friends are.

    I'm getting a bit off track now, but what I meant by showing your intentions was more in terms of what you don't do, like backstabbing the guy.
    In Dark Souls, and Fractured, though the visual setup of Fractured makes it a little more difficult, you can show, by keeping your distance, where you stand, whether you help them fight their enemies (here I'm thinking more of Dark Souls 1 and being a blue phantom, where you can help the host you invaded kill red phantoms) stuff like that, whether you want to help them, fight them as the game intends, nothing personal, or if you are just a guy that goes around killing people in the middle of difficult areas because you're good at the game and their not and you find it funny.

    there is a fine line between boredom and frustration, and defining that line is exactly what I am interested in doing.


    @darwinjay all things being equal, two strangers meeting in a game have less to work with than two strangers meeting in real life, considering facial expressions, body language, tone of voice, etc. and while I can't say I've ever met a serial killer, I would like to think I could more easily figure it out in person than in game, even if only when he actually pulls out the chainsaw.

    I am glad that my posts haven't been too subtle, I am indeed hoping people notice me.

    My posts in which I have discussed evil alignment with Nekrage, who I wont tag this time 😛 may address this somewhat, but please consider that gamers are people too, and considering that this is not purely a PvP game, it cannot be said that all players, by playing the game, know what they're signing up for as it were.

    What I am trying to impress is that there are likely to be a lot of players, not only in Fractured, that are new to the game, or bad at PvP, or just don't want to fight every player they come across that wants to fight them.

    In the completed game, there will be mechanics to separate players of different interests, for the most part, and the times when they do interact they should be able to prepare for it. Until then, while all players are in one place, and the mechanics are not, I am suggesting that players can act like this is actually a test, and that people are entitled to test the things they want to test.
    So, if you, being a red player, encounter a guy called 'falling leaf' or something like that, and he doesn't immediately come at you swinging, maybe he doesn't want to fight you, so ask him, or 'leaf' (lol) him alone.
    And if you do defeat someone, considering it's a test, is it really necessary to actually kill him? Do you really need his loot?


    @Yitra I'm not sure what you mean by invasions in Arboreus and hostile zones, did I miss something?
    In the completed game there will be reasons not to attack people, and if you do, not to kill them/ loot them, unless you are going for a full-negative-karma build, in which case there will be (hopefully) some sort of law enforcement you will have to match wits and steel with.

    I frankly can only make a guess at what "full loot PvP game means" but expecting gentlemanly behaviour is exactly my point: Players are people; you would not, or at least should not, act in real life the way it is the norm to act in games:
    Even when intending to do something in real life that will inconvenience or harm a person, whatever the reason (I'm talking like; police enforcing laws, and I mean in general, I am not commenting on any current events. Or being in a hurry driving to work so you overtake someone not exactly safely, or cut in front of someone. I'm trying to think of something that causes inconvenience but isn't mean, but all I can think of are crimes 😛)

    My point is: even if you were going to do, whatever the real life equivalent of killing someone in a game is, you wouldn't be rude about it like people are in games, even though it's mostly the games inadequacy to blame. Yes, you might be polite to their face while you did, whatever it is, and then complain about it later, but you would at least be polite to their face. In a game, you just kill them and take their stuff, because it's a game and that's what the game's about.

    as to dealing with syndesia 'as is', it is currently testing phase, and perhaps people could act like it, there is no need to do what would be in character and acceptable in a game, during a testing phase. We have established that killing people works and you can take their stuff, now test other things.

  • Moderator


    If he isn't red, he can't attack you.
    If someone is red, he is accepting a big risk in exchange for being able to attack players, so if you see red, start shooting.


    @spoletta Then what is the indication of evil alignment? my understanding was that a red name meant evil alignment.

  • Moderator

    They are one and the same.
    If someone is evil, he is red.
    Only evil players can attack you.
    If someone isn't red, they can't attack you.


    @spoletta but isn't there a hostile setting? I think the button is P? there's a little symbol somewhere on the screen with crossed swords or something, are evil players permanently in that state?

  • Moderator

    That button enables pvp, but only evil players can attack non evil players.

    A good player which activates that only gets to attack red players.

    Also, if you don't have a good reason to activate it, don't. It makes you susceptible to friendy fire.


    @spoletta ok, but is there a way to tell if an evil player has PvP mode enabled? or is it permanently activated for evil players?


    @Mirgannel12 said in In Communicado:

    @Yitra I'm not sure what you mean by invasions in Arboreus and hostile zones, did I miss something?

    I would start with reading this article, it might make some aspects of the game more clear to you:


    @Yitra sorry, still not seeing anything about hostile zones on Arboreus, it mentions areas that can't have PvP, but I didn't see anything about PvP specific areas, can you find me a quote?

    P.S how do you do that thing with the little quote at the end of your posts and the link to your guild?

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